Author Topic: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute  (Read 8918 times)

Offline mefree

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Info on Baldwin Research Institute was posted on WWP
http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/baldwin-research-institute-a-scientology-fraud.29387/

More searching reveals multiple website
http://www.google.com/search?q=Baldwin+Research+Institute&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

http://www.permanent-solution.com/index.cfm
http://www.permanent-solution.com/jude-thaddeus-program-1.cfm#1
http://www.permanent-solution.com/faq.cfm
http://www.saintjudecountryretreat.com/jude-thaddeus-program.php


Quote
Baldwin Research Institute’s technology and theory behind addiction as a behavioral problem and not a disease is not new and has been researched in detail by many in the mental health field including William R. Miller, Ph.D. and Jeffrey Schaler, Ph.D. just to name a few.

Jeffrey Schaler, phd
Quote
Jeff Schaler is the owner and producer of. The Thomas S. Szasz Cybercenter for Liberty and Responsibility
http://www.szasz.com/schaler/index.html
www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-iYngr6N60 (uploaded by CCHRint)

Dr. Joy seems to be plugging St Jude or the Jude Thaddeus Program, aliases?
http://www.drjoy.com/

This price comparison makes no mention of Narconon,  PurDetox.
http://www.soberforever.net/drug-treatment-alcohol-treatment-compared.cfm
Interesting mention of past traumas.
If you are not cured in 6 weeks, you might need some continuing education
http://www.soberforever.net/cevideo.cfm

There is a Richard Santelli that is an Oklahoma City, OK chiropractor. Not certain if there is a connection there.
The ultimate authority must always rest with the individual's own reason and critical analysis.
-Dalai Lama

Offline Sarcasm Pirate

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2011, 23:59 »
It bothers me to see more and more of these groups taking bits of what would appear to be Scientology or Narconon and blending it into their programs as if it was any other well accepted fact.  I sometimes wonder if this is how Scientology will end up.  The cult will crumble to pieces but leave behind these little 'bastard' (Sorry mod.:-P ) groups that manage to keep Hubbard's practices alive.  I don't think they'll always be as overt as Narconon and the like but if it smells like a rat...

Offline Mary_McConnell

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2011, 00:44 »
Hi SP,

It bothers me, too. I do believe it is in response to all the negative press the front groups are getting. This effects PR and the money coming in, both which effect ABLE, Int stats. As long as the materials are agreed to be used in the way they are written, then contracts with alternative companies and physicians for selected materials seem to be being made, so long as they pay the royalties or % of fees charges on their use.

Another issue is the pressure being brought to bear on the front groups to use licensed appropriate medical detox instead of just their sham sauna detox because of multiple lawsuits.
Some can be found here:  http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=21790

Using alternative companies who use additional methods as well makes it harder to find out where the Scientology materials are being used but there are a few of us that are working hard to expose these places.

For the church, it's all about stats and the mighty $.


I am a volunteer advocate for victims of the Narconon scam. I am a former scientologist. I post anonymously. Mary McConnell is my long time nom de plume. Feel free to contact me for assistance in righting the wrongs.

Offline sekh

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2011, 12:32 »
In their info they tell what's wrong with every other program,but they don't say how their program works. Some vague crap about positive life-choices, but nothing about how their therapy works, what they do. At least Narconon tells you about sauna's and vitamin overdoses.

These guys don't say anything about how they detox the client, nor how the positive lifestyle education works. Neither do they tell you how much it's going to cost.
I don't like it. Just a gut feeling that something is kinda fishy here.

I wouldn't be strange if CoS shows up with new names in addiction care. Too many people know by now, specially in the English-speaking part of the world, that Narconon=Scientology. That's bad for business.

I don't know if these guys are related to Narconon, but it wouldn't surprise me if they were.

A bit creepy, if you ask me. Love, Sekh.   
A slogan a day keeps the thinking away! (Agent Orange) AND WHERE IS HEBER JENTZSCH?

Offline ethercat

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2011, 13:52 »
It bothers me to see more and more of these groups taking bits of what would appear to be Scientology or Narconon and blending it into their programs as if it was any other well accepted fact.  I sometimes wonder if this is how Scientology will end up.  The cult will crumble to pieces but leave behind these little 'bastard' (Sorry mod.:-P ) groups that manage to keep Hubbard's practices alive.  I don't think they'll always be as overt as Narconon and the like but if it smells like a rat...

There is a bigger problem in society than just Narconon, and that is the willingness of people to believe in "alternative treatments" and "alternative medicine" which have no foundation in science or verified workability.  Sometimes I wonder if we should be raising awareness about quackery instead of scientology; it certainly affects more people, but there are also more people working on that problem than on the scientology problem, so I guess I'll stick with it.   ;)

So many people of today seem to have no interest whatsoever in the "hard sciences" and prefer instead the "touchy-feely" arts (?).  Witness the number of "detoxes" advertised which are not related to Scientology or Narconon.

In their info they tell what's wrong with every other program,but they don't say how their program works. Some vague crap about positive life-choices, but nothing about how their therapy works, what they do. At least Narconon tells you about sauna's and vitamin overdoses.

Good point, sekh.  Any treatment center that is unwilling to disclose their methodology should be viewed with suspicion, as should any treatment center that registers their domain name under a proxy, which at least this one didn't, but plenty of the Narconon-related ones, and possibly others, do:

Quote
Registrant:
 Baldwin Research Institute
 9 Market St, Ste 4
 Amsterdam, NY 12010
 US

 Domain name: BALDWINRESEARCH.COM

 Administrative Contact:
    hostmaster, hostmaster  hostmaster@baldwinresearch.com
    9 Market St, Ste 4
    Amsterdam, NY 12010
    US
    +1.5188422204
 Technical Contact:
    Hostmaster, Hostmaster  hostmaster@logical.net
    450 Duane Ave
    Schenectady, NY 12304
    US
    +1.5182924500

 Registrar of Record: TUCOWS, INC.
 Record last updated on 16-Jan-2011.
 Record expires on 14-Feb-2012.
 Record created on 14-Feb-1999.

Quote
Domain ID:D23810180-LRMS
Domain Name:STJUDERETREAT.INFO
Created On:15-Feb-2008 20:10:16 UTC
Last Updated On:25-Jan-2010 15:29:33 UTC
Expiration Date:15-Feb-2011 20:10:16 UTC

Registrant ID:CR23779774
Registrant Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Registrant Organization:
Registrant Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Registrant City:Amsterdam
Registrant State/Province:New York
Registrant Postal Code:12010
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.5188422204
Registrant Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org

Admin ID:CR23779776
Admin Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Admin Organization:
Admin Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Admin City:Amsterdam
Admin State/Province:New York
Admin Postal Code:12010
Admin Country:US
Admin Phone:+1.5188422204
Admin Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org
Billing ID:CR23779777
Billing Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Billing Organization:
Billing Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Billing City:Amsterdam
Billing State/Province:New York
Billing Postal Code:12010
Billing Country:US
Billing Phone:+1.5188422204
Billing Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org

Tech ID:CR23779775
Tech Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Tech Organization:
Tech Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Tech City:Amsterdam
Tech State/Province:New York
Tech Postal Code:12010
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.5188422204
Tech Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org
Name Server:NS33.DOMAINCONTROL.COM
Name Server:NS34.DOMAINCONTROL.COM

Quote
Domain ID:D23810180-LRMS
Domain Name:STJUDERETREAT.INFO
Created On:15-Feb-2008 20:10:16 UTC
Last Updated On:25-Jan-2010 15:29:33 UTC
Expiration Date:15-Feb-2011 20:10:16 UTC
Sponsoring Registrar:GoDaddy.com Inc. (R171-LRMS)

Registrant ID:CR23779774
Registrant Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Registrant Organization:
Registrant Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Registrant City:Amsterdam
Registrant State/Province:New York
Registrant Postal Code:12010
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.5188422204
Registrant Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org

Admin ID:CR23779776
Admin Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Admin Organization:
Admin Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Admin Street2:
Admin Street3:
Admin City:Amsterdam
Admin State/Province:New York
Admin Postal Code:12010
Admin Country:US
Admin Phone:+1.5188422204
Admin Phone Ext.:
Admin FAX:
Admin FAX Ext.:
Admin Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org

Billing ID:CR23779777
Billing Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Billing Organization:
Billing Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Billing City:Amsterdam
Billing State/Province:New York
Billing Postal Code:12010
Billing Country:US
Billing Phone:+1.5188422204
Billing Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org

Tech ID:CR23779775
Tech Name:Daniel Hidalgo
Tech Organization:
Tech Street1:9 Market St  Ste 4
Tech City:Amsterdam
Tech State/Province:New York
Tech Postal Code:12010
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.5188422204
Tech Email:dhidalgo@soberforever.org
Name Server:NS33.DOMAINCONTROL.COM
Name Server:NS34.DOMAINCONTROL.COM

Quote
These guys don't say anything about how they detox the client, nor how the positive lifestyle education works. Neither do they tell you how much it's going to cost.
I don't like it. Just a gut feeling that something is kinda fishy here.

I wouldn't be strange if CoS shows up with new names in addiction care. Too many people know by now, specially in the English-speaking part of the world, that Narconon=Scientology. That's bad for business.

I don't know if these guys are related to Narconon, but it wouldn't surprise me if they were.

A bit creepy, if you ask me. Love, Sekh.   

There are some summaries of the books and CDs they sell, here: http://www.homerecovery.us/home-addiction-program.html

I have looked at this organization before and came to no conclusions.  The links I have are tenuous, but I will post them in case someone else wants to do some further digging.

http://stjuderetreat.info/?p=15 mentions Dr. Jeffrey Schaler, author of Addiction is a Choice.  It also has the following statement:
Quote
Whether you try Alcoholics Anonymous, Narcotics Anonymous, the Betty Ford Clinic, Passages Malibu, Cirque Lodge, Hazelden or Narconon you are met with a barrage of double talk.

Dr. Schaler has been cited by CCHR, according to Dr. Conrad Maulfair: http://www.drmaulfair.com/jeremy_perkins.htm but the link has been removed, possibly on the request of Dr. Schaler, and I could not find a cached copy anywhere.  Here is Dr. Maulfair's link, though: http://www.cchr.org/files/14887/48_HOURS_INTERVIEW_WITH_DR_JEFFREY_SCHALER_PH_D.pdf

Who is Dr. Conrad Maulfair?  None other than the owner of Purely You Detox, which I posted about here: http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,6279.0.html

Dr. Schaler has had a run-in with Dr. Peter Breggin, another academic with murky possible ties to Scientology and CCHR:
http://www.schaler.net/fifth/breggin.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Breggin

Dr. Schaler has written a paper on cults: http://www.schaler.net/cults.pdf
and there's this other writing that, at a quick glance, seems more focused on AA than anything else: http://www.schaler.net/fifth/cultbusting.html

I have no conclusions at this point.  Feel free to run with this info for your own research.   :)
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Offline sekh

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2011, 14:20 »
Schaler-Szasz-CCHR-Co$-Narconon.

Szasz was, with L.Ron Hubbard, the founder of CCHR, which clearly is a Scientology frontgroup.
That's a fairly straight connection.

But this institute may just as well be based on Szasz's anti-psychiatry as on Hubbard's scino-tech.

I don't know. Maybe it little bit of both, with some Skinner and Pavlov to spice up the mix. We'll only know it if we try it and I'm not gonna volunteer.

Love, Sekh.
A slogan a day keeps the thinking away! (Agent Orange) AND WHERE IS HEBER JENTZSCH?

Offline mefree

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2011, 14:22 »
LOL
The ultimate authority must always rest with the individual's own reason and critical analysis.
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Offline ethercat

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2011, 20:07 »
Well, this is an interesting development.  Someone by the name of Steven Slate has turned up in a similar thread on WWP on January 26, and says that he is a former employee of Baldwin Research Institute and and a former client of the Saint Jude Retreat House.  He points to his blog, and mentions a post he made to the blog on December 3, 2010: http://www.thecleanslate.org/new-face-of-recovery-is-a-front-for-narconon-and-scientology/

Anons are skeptical, as anons tend to be, and are wise to be, and some discussion ensues.

And then, a person who says they are a former client, 2 times, of BRI, appears on February 7.  He says that in no way are they scientology, but that there are many issues with the program, some as serious as the issues with Narconon.

He says that the program, in a nutshell, consists of "Stop being a selfish, self-destructive idiot and go have fun with your life and be good to other people while you're at it because that will also make you feel good about you". 

He also has something not so good to say about the BRI-claimed success rate; and something to say about the testimonials on the site, and the staff:

Quote
The testimonials found on the site? I know for certain that 2 of the 3 videotaped/posted testimonials of "former guests" are either current or former employees. Yes, they were former guests, but the thing is that ALL but what.....2 or 3 of the employees are former guests. And, I do mean all...from the "janitor/maintenance men", to the cooks, to the drivers, to the instructors, to the "directors", to the accountant, to the fucking VP executive marketing hand job giver. Also, outside of the CFO or Accountant or whatever he is, we're talking about a family business here. Now, this is actually fairly common at a lot of treatment centers (hiring former patients, clients, guests, or whatever, not the family bit) and to a degree, it makes a lot of sense. Number one, recently sober people often embrace their "newfound way of life" with true and abundant zeal. Who better to "pass it on" or relate to the newbies, than the newly sober who are also seeking to bolster their own recovery.....er....recoveredness.. ..by giving back? That's all well and fine, but there's another thing that newly sober people are really good at: Getting high. In my experiences at St. Jude I knew of (as in personally used with, observed the resultant termination of, or in one case, heard about the death of) several "instructors", an "activity director" and one "house director" using drugs and/or alcohol. Again, this is not uncommon in the treatment industry and is not necessarily a St. Jude problem exclusively, but I will say that the claims about average sobriety length of the staff are a fucking joke. I found an email from a St. Jude staffer on orange-papers.org claiming the average sobriety time to be 5-6 years. Man. These guys are reeeeeeeeeaaaaaaally sneaky with math. What that means is, three or four people (who almost never interact with clients save a Sunday "family" breakfast, and maybe a bi-monthly 45 minute power point presentation) have like 30 some odd years, and everyone else has a few months. The majority of staff that clients actually rub elbows with or, "do the work with" so to speak, are brand spanking new. Beyond that, they employ no real medical/psychiatric professionals, and rely on scarcely educated folks to do the heavy lifting....they also tend to be young adult (22-26ish) males.....more on that later. So....where the fuck does that $10,000 (was I think 5 or 6,000 back in '03) for 6 weeks go? Not to the barely post-adolescent boys instructing, that I know. Not to the food or activity budget either...

...

For me, the greatest injustice of all is St. Jude/BRI's CONSTANT slandering of A.A. No, not because I support A.A. (it's a religious cult, with rigid dogma and rituals and little to zero efficacy), but because....well....the St. Jude Thaddeus program IS A.A. I know, weird right? Basically, the St. Jude program is identical to the 12-steps, and its crux (and a "guests" likelihood of success) rests on willingness to "serve others".
...
The only difference? St. Jude insists meetings are unnecessary, it's all about choice, and that after completing the "workbook" you're cured for life!! I just can't believe how much effort they put into distancing themselves from A.A. whilst simultaneously being A.A. The funny part is that St. Jude NEEDS A.A. and Hazelden, and Betty Ford, and shitty meetings in gross church basements. Why? Because St. Jude's target market consists of people either disillusioned with "traditional recovery approaches", or horrified at the idea of having to do meetings and any kind of work to stay clean over the long haul, or both.
...
St. Jude needs A.A. to exist so they can sell their services based around NOT being A.A. Anyone familiar with A.A. history knows that "pre-1956 A.A." means A.A. before the word disease was thrown out there....well, that's St. Jude.

Then Steven Slate reappears, and offers his regrets to 2x Former Guest, and offers a range of other non-12-step alternatives to him, if he hasn't solved his problem yet, and his congratulations if he has. 

Unedited version: http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/baldwin-research-institute-a-scientology-fraud.29387/#post-1363888

I guess Narconon isn't the only rehab center that the bad stuff happens; it just happens to be on our radar because it's Scientology (Narconon, that is.)
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Offline Mary_McConnell

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2011, 12:04 »
Sadly, there are many bad rebas out there.

Thanks for reporting that. That linked article is good!
I am a volunteer advocate for victims of the Narconon scam. I am a former scientologist. I post anonymously. Mary McConnell is my long time nom de plume. Feel free to contact me for assistance in righting the wrongs.

Offline mefree

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2011, 12:50 »
Interesting article.

I know it has been said before, but we need better standards for drug treatment in the U.S.
The ultimate authority must always rest with the individual's own reason and critical analysis.
-Dalai Lama

Offline dhidalgo

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2011, 10:17 »
No it is not

I have been working at this place for 5 years now... I am Roman Catholic, and truly dont understand the confusion! If we were scientology, we would clearly say so, but we are not. (NOTE: I wouldn't be working here if we were). Please take a few minutes of your time, and give us a call, we would love to explain how our 'SOCIAL EDUCATIONAL' program helps people... this will only be the best way for you to judge.

You can call directly 518-842-2204

Thanks

Daniel

Offline ethercat

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2011, 11:07 »
Welcome, Daniel, and thanks for popping in to offer your statement.  I'd love to see you participate in some of our narconon discussions, but I can also understand if you'd prefer not to be seen as "badmouthing the competition."

No it is not

I have been working at this place for 5 years now... I am Roman Catholic, and truly dont understand the confusion! If we were scientology, we would clearly say so, but we are not. (NOTE: I wouldn't be working here if we were). Please take a few minutes of your time, and give us a call, we would love to explain how our 'SOCIAL EDUCATIONAL' program helps people... this will only be the best way for you to judge.

You can call directly 518-842-2204

Thanks

Daniel

I think we (here at RFTTP) had already concluded that St. Jude was not narconon, but let me explain that part of our tin-foil hattedness about other rehabs possibly being associated with narconon is exactly because the groups that are associated do not "clearly say so".  They will, in fact, deny it, just as narconon will deny a connection to scientology despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

I hope you understand that our motivation is a desire to help people steer clear of anything that will take them down the scientology rabbit hole.

I think some of the cause for concern was the mystery surrounding what your organization does - the fact that there is no clear statement on the website about exactly how your social education program works.  It would be nice if you could clarify that, both here and on the site.  I understand trade secrets and all that, but I don't see how this sort of thing could fall under that umbrella.

Thanks for offering to take people's phone calls. 
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Offline mefree

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2012, 19:56 »
Something of interest for followers of this thread:

ST JUDE'S RECOVERY CTR - DETOX
http://167.193.144.170:7001/ORSINV/HTML_DRUGABUSE/DRUG012368I3N411.htm

ST JUDE'S RECOVERY CTR - MEN'S RESIDENTIAL SERV
http://167.193.144.170:7001/ORSINV/HTML_DRUGABUSE/DRUG001179NO6711.htm

ST JUDE'S RECOVERY CTR - OUTPATIENT DAY TX
http://167.193.144.170:7001/ORSINV/HTML_DRUGABUSE/DRUG0124239RPF11.htm

ST JUDE'S RECOVERY CTR - READY FOR WORK OUTPATIENT
http://167.193.144.170:7001/ORSINV/HTML_DRUGABUSE/DRUG0012473JZP11.htm

ST JUDE'S RECOVERY CTR - WOMEN'S RESIDENTIAL S
http://167.193.144.170:7001/ORSINV/HTML_DRUGABUSE/DRUG00103773EZ11.htm
The ultimate authority must always rest with the individual's own reason and critical analysis.
-Dalai Lama

Offline DeathHamster

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2015, 13:30 »

Offline AnonLover

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2015, 15:22 »
How NOT to stay off my radar:

http://saint-jude-retreats-is-not-narconon.com/

LMAO! Ohhh my gawd, the butthurt runs deep. What a rant!

Offline mefree

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2015, 17:51 »
LMAO! Ohhh my gawd, the butthurt runs deep. What a rant!

 3((:
The ultimate authority must always rest with the individual's own reason and critical analysis.
-Dalai Lama

Offline BigBeard

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2015, 23:26 »
Why does, "...doth protest too much, methinks" keep running through my head when I read that mess?

And someone needs to explain to him why a yellow background for text is very, very, annoying.
BigBeard

Offline ethercat

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2015, 10:32 »
That was written, and the domain name registered, in 2011, in the midst of the forum postings about them.  An understandable attempt at damage control. 

I don't think it's necessarily a bad statement to have on the web - had they omitted the "name and shame" - considering that wwp's discussion (and possibly ours, too) probably appears in search results.  Certainly, what they wrote about Narconon is more of a statement than most other treatment centers have made.

But the "name and shame":  (:E)

My suggestion to Mr. Hidalgo, since he will be getting notifications of these posts unless he's abandoned the email address he registered here with, is to rewrite (or have Mr. Brown rewrite) portions of the page and eliminate the understandable bitterness that shows from the 2011 encounters, but leave the statements about Narconon and the history. 

Just some friendly advice.   :)



Scientology has a way of tainting everyone it touches - even when one is trying hard not to be touched.   :(
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Offline BigBeard

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2015, 11:43 »
If they do a rewrite, they also need to lose that yellow backgroud.
BigBeard

Offline DeathHamster

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Re: Is this related to Narconon? Baldwin Research Institute
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2015, 13:13 »
If he hadn't used Narconon in the name, it wouldn't have turned up when I was doing a domain search.