Reaching For the Tipping Point

Narconon and Other Scientology Front Groups => Narconon in California => Topic started by: ethercat on November 21, 2011, 11:59

Title: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on November 21, 2011, 11:59
Apparently, the stories we've heard about dirty and unsafe conditions at Narconon facilities are true, at least in this case. 

This is a Notice of Deficiency from the California Health and Human Services Agency, Department of Alcohol and Drug Programs for Narconon Fresh Start (formerly Narconon Southern California) specifically cited against Sunshine Summit Lodge on as inspected on September 14, 2011.  This was an unannounced licensing compliance review conducted at 35025 Highway 79 in Warner Springs, California 92086.  Executive Director Malia Martyak was present for the review.

Deficiencies are categorized as Classes A, B, and C.  Narconon Sunshine Summit Lodge received 9 citations for Class B deficiencies, and 4 for Class C.

Class A: problems which present imminent danger to residents, and must be corrected immediately. 

Class B: potential health danger to residents, staff, and visitors, and must be corrected within 30 days of notice of deficiency.  There is a $50 per day fine that begins accruing on the 30th day until the licensee submits verification that all deficiencies are corrected or until the date a written CAP (Corrective Action Plan) is received and approved by the Department.

Class C: appear to be administrative type deficiencies, such as record keeping and documentation, and includes a fine of $25 per day for each citation beginning on the 31st day.

Maximum fee per day is $150.

Some of the class B deficiencies cited are things that will make you go EEWW!  I'll just note a few, and you can read the document yourself if you haven't already gagged from what I mention here (read the document even if you have already gagged; it is truly disgusting):

Refrigerator at 48 degrees, spoiled milk and uncovered liquid supplements inside
Large pot of oil uncovered on stove in kitchen
Laundry table with rotting wood
Cigarette butts all over the ground outside a room
Uncovered electrical outlets
Spider/cob webs
Furniture that should be repaired or thrown out
Mold and filth found everywhere

Here is the document:
http://alley.ethercat.com/storage/Narconon/Narconon_San_Diego_Notice_of_Deficiency-2011-09-14.pdf

Given this information, who would willingly send their loved one here?  How can one be expected to recover from addiction in surroundings like this?  These are the people who are supposed to be teaching and providing an example to recovering addicts about the proper way to live without drugs??

Who would even want something like this in their county or their state?

Many thanks to the person who provided the document for us.

We have another thread about this facility; in 2010 the water system was tested by the County Department of Environmental Health and was found to contain coliform bacteria: http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,4259.0.html
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on November 21, 2011, 12:13
Apparently, the stories we've heard about dirty and unsafe conditions at Narconon facilities are untrue, at least in this case. 

Did you mean true?

I bet that place is full of mold with all of the ceiling leaks, yuck! 
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on November 21, 2011, 12:43
Apparently, the stories we've heard about dirty and unsafe conditions at Narconon facilities are untrue, at least in this case. 

Did you mean true?

I bet that place is full of mold with all of the ceiling leaks, yuck!

Quite right, I guess I was in too big of a hurry - correcting now.   

 |ooops|
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on November 28, 2011, 18:40
From WWP

http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/narconon-application-warner-springs.97028/#post-1971891
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on November 28, 2011, 19:35
I'll see your WWP and raise you a RFTTP: http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,6887.0.html

 ;)

Ok, now I don't know the area, or how many narconons they may have on Hwy 79, but the RFTTP thread shows:
Resident Capacity: 6
Total Occupancy: 8

And in this new PDF, they claim 6 staff - I'm confused; is this something to look at?  Or are these 2 different places?
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on November 28, 2011, 22:57
There are two facilities licensed by the California Alcohol and Drug Program (ADP) in Sunshine Summit, Narconon Fresh Start JBL Ranch and Narconon Fresh Start Sunshine Summit Lodge.

In 2002 Narconon Southern California was required by the County of San Diego to apply and have approved a Major Use Permit (MUP) in order to operate a residential drug rehab facility. After two planning commission hearings and an appeal to the County Board of Supervisors, the MUP (MUP 01-020) was approved in December 2002 and Narconon Warner Springs opened in 2003.

Narconon Warner Springs, Narconon San Diego, Sunshine Summit Lodge and now Narconon Fresh Start Sunshine Summit Lodge are all the same facility. The address is 35025 Highway 79 Warner Spring CA 92086.

Narconon Fresh Start JLB Ranch 35955 Highway 79 Warner Spring about a mile west of the lodge on Highway 79 opened sometime in 2009/2010 not sure the date, perhaps someone could find out.

Due to serving 6 or fewer clients Narconon JLB is not required to have a MUP to operate- reply #5 http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,6887.0.html

But to be licensed by ADP the facility is required to provide a fire clearance from the fire authority that has jurisdiction, in this case the San Diego County Fire Marshal. The form required is ADP’s Form 850 and it is completed by the fire marshal then submitted to ADP.

In the case of JLB Ranch, the size of the house and layout determines the number of clients/staff that can reside at the facility, six clients and two staff.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on November 28, 2011, 22:58
Its JLB Ranch not JBL.
Sorry.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: SocialTransparency on November 30, 2011, 18:09
 Google earth shows the address as the middle of the road way. A closer look via street view does not look like a very soothing environment . Kind of looks like its out in the boondocks. I bet a million dollars the facility has beige walls and overhead fluorescent lights to hurt ones eyes.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on December 03, 2011, 10:01
Thanks for the clarification, Sunshine.

Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on December 03, 2011, 10:20
Narconon Fresh Start JLB Ranch 35955 Highway 79 Warner Spring about a mile west of the lodge on Highway 79 opened sometime in 2009/2010 not sure the date, perhaps someone could find out.

Due to serving 6 or fewer clients Narconon JLB is not required to have a MUP to operate- reply #5 http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,6887.0.html

But to be licensed by ADP the facility is required to provide a fire clearance from the fire authority that has jurisdiction, in this case the San Diego County Fire Marshal. The form required is ADP’s Form 850 and it is completed by the fire marshal then submitted to ADP.

In the case of JLB Ranch, the size of the house and layout determines the number of clients/staff that can reside at the facility, six clients and two staff.

So, by opening a smaller operation not subject to the MUP, they manage to avoid additional oversight. Y/N?
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on December 03, 2011, 12:07
That is correct, in the state of California 6 or fewer clients is considered the same as a residential home and the county/city cannot impose  restrictions that are different from a typical family’s residents. 
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on December 03, 2011, 13:09
Thanks, Sunshine.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 20, 2011, 20:18
I don't know how I missed this thread, the juicy dox and additional information!!

mefree, the JLB Ranch is still required to be licensed with only 6 beds. The are on the ADP  list I believe.

I bet Narconon So Cal got busted for having more patients at WArner Springs than they were licensed for, having patients residing in this place before it was licensed and they got the bright idea to adapt it with a sauna and apply for another facility license, than risk losing 6 more bodies to add to their weekly management 'statistics'.  BTW, they were using this name on the internet before they applied for their dba and facility licenses. Seen that before...
 
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on December 20, 2011, 20:32
Quote
I bet Narconon So Cal got busted for having more patients at WArner Springs than they were licensed for, having patients residing in this place before it was licensed and they got the bright idea to adapt it with a sauna and apply for another facility license, than risk losing 6 more bodies to add to their weekly management 'statistics'.  BTW, they were using this name on the internet before they applied for their dba and facility licenses. Seen that before...

I'm not surprised. Following rules, guidelines or laws isn't a priority for some.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 20, 2011, 20:36
Yes, thank you to who ever provided this document! I shall spread the news of this thread.
http://alley.ethercat.com/storage/Narconon/Narconon_San_Diego_Notice_of_Deficiency-2011-09-14.pdf

Too bad they didn't catch them on a day when they were over capacity, which is normal for them.

It will be interesting to find out what the training program for staff will be. Too bed the inspoector didn't know about all the volunteers they pay a recent graduates turned staff trainees a stipend to, who are not even recorded  or treated as staff but who deal directly with "students."

I wish they would visit all the facilities in CA and more often. The fines are too low if you ask me.

Thanks so much for making me happy tonite reading this. It shows that sometimes the complaints get action, even in slow sunny California where the complaint backlog grows and grows for lack of a viable budget
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 20, 2012, 15:12
The address for Narconon New Life, Narconon San Diego, Narconon Warner Springs and Narconon Sunshine Summit Lodge is 35025 Highway 79 Warner Springs CA 92086

Check out the address in the crime report below

http://www.localcrimenews.com/lookup.php?jid=6609151
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 20, 2012, 16:23
There are two facilities licensed by the California Alcohol and Drug Program (ADP) in Sunshine Summit, Narconon Fresh Start JBL Ranch and Narconon Fresh Start Sunshine Summit Lodge.

In 2002 Narconon Southern California was required by the County of San Diego to apply and have approved a Major Use Permit (MUP) in order to operate a residential drug rehab facility. After two planning commission hearings and an appeal to the County Board of Supervisors, the MUP (MUP 01-020) was approved in December 2002 and Narconon Warner Springs opened in 2003.

Narconon Warner Springs, Narconon San Diego, Sunshine Summit Lodge and now Narconon Fresh Start Sunshine Summit Lodge are all the same facility. The address is 35025 Highway 79 Warner Spring CA 92086.

Narconon Fresh Start JLB Ranch 35955 Highway 79 Warner Spring about a mile west of the lodge on Highway 79 opened sometime in 2009/2010 not sure the date, perhaps someone could find out.

Due to serving 6 or fewer clients Narconon JLB is not required to have a MUP to operate- reply #5 http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,6887.0.html

But to be licensed by ADP the facility is required to provide a fire clearance from the fire authority that has jurisdiction, in this case the San Diego County Fire Marshal. The form required is ADP’s Form 850 and it is completed by the fire marshal then submitted to ADP.

In the case of JLB Ranch, the size of the house and layout determines the number of clients/staff that can reside at the facility, six clients and two staff.

You just know they have other unlicensed locations beside this JLB place... right in that area. Just like Narconon Joshua Hills dba Narconon Desert rehab sis ( 6 houses for a license for 6 people! - thankfully shut down now)

I bet that the only reason they filed for a license on JLB Ranch is that they got caught via a complaint from someone who was staying at that JLB address. I knew about the location but not the address until about a year ago but complaints go farther back about being in a smaller place nearby to the lodge.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 20, 2012, 18:53



Warner Springs Arrest Records 
Arrest Information
 
BLOCKED: PRIVACY PROTECTION* Map It
35025 Highway 79
Warner Springs , CA 92086-9709 Verified Address

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reported: 12/09/2011 by Crime Reporter: 5081
Crime Report #: 6609151
Source: Southwest Detention Center SD

F HS11350(A) Possession Of A Controlled Substance
M HS11550(A) Use/Under Influence Controlled Substance

Bail Amount: 5000
Residing in Crime Beat Zone: San Diego North County Coastal
 
 http://www.localcrimenews.com/lookup.php?jid=6609151
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 20, 2012, 19:06
So glad we have you here, Sunshine! You are so resourceful!

Perhaps the facility reported the student? They do actually do that some times. I mean, have you seen that area? Looks like a ghost town, lol
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: xenubarb on April 21, 2012, 14:12
I don't know how I missed this thread, the juicy dox and additional information!!

mefree, the JLB Ranch is still required to be licensed with only 6 beds. The are on the ADP  list I believe.

I bet Narconon So Cal got busted for having more patients at WArner Springs than they were licensed for, having patients residing in this place before it was licensed and they got the bright idea to adapt it with a sauna and apply for another facility license, than risk losing 6 more bodies to add to their weekly management 'statistics'.  BTW, they were using this name on the internet before they applied for their dba and facility licenses. Seen that before...
 

They started out as scofflaws, I went up to Sunshine Summit before they were certified to open and it was already full of clients. I'm willing to run up there again if given a good reason!
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 21, 2012, 20:42
I believe Narconon Fresh Start JLB Ranch Warner Springs is used to provide a drug withdrawal facility. http://www.drugrehab.com/jlb_ranch.html .

Due to Narconon Fresh Start Warner Springs Major Use Permit (MUP P01-020) from MUP P01-020 below:

B. Upon certification by the Director of Planning and Land Use for occupancy or establishment of use allowed by this Major Use Permit, the following conditions shall apply:
1. Outdoor activities shall be limited to the hours between 8:30 a.m. and 8:00 p.m.

2.  Active use of the property shall be restricted to the approximate 2-acre developed portion of the overall 30-acre site, located nearest SR 79. The remainder of the property may be used for passive activities including walking, small group discussions and meditation.

3. The following security measures shall be in force at all times:
a. There will be no students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility that are medically dependent, or that would potentially need emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 21, 2012, 20:55
I believe Narconon Fresh Start JLB Ranch Warner Springs is used to provide a drug withdrawal facility. http://www.drugrehab.com/jlb_ranch.html .

Due to Narconon Fresh Start Warner Springs Major Use Permit (MUP P01-020) from MUP P01-020 below:

B. Upon certification by the Director of Planning and Land Use for occupancy or establishment of use allowed by this Major Use Permit, the following conditions shall apply:
1. Outdoor activities shall be limited to the hours between 8:30 a.m. and 8:00 p.m.

2.  Active use of the property shall be restricted to the approximate 2-acre developed portion of the overall 30-acre site, located nearest SR 79. The remainder of the property may be used for passive activities including walking, small group discussions and meditation.

3. The following security measures shall be in force at all times:
a. There will be no students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility that are medically dependent, or that would potentially need emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol.


This makes sense except that NN contracts the medical detox out, as they are a 'drug free' detox company. JLB Ranch would have, according to their scheme, to be like Orange County Detox or one of the others they subcontract to. So if this is true, that JLB Ranch might just be used for detox, then Narconon is running a 'squirrel' program, lol

** i really need an editor :)
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 21, 2012, 21:27
I think they still farm out the medical detox , this is for the “or that would potentially  need emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs  or alcohol”.

According to the Major Use Permit individuals that enter the program are suppose to be “drug free”.

Staff Response: The applicant submitted a description of daily operations as part of the security plan requested by staff. Since students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility would not include medically supervised drug withdrawals and all students would attend of their own accord, this would not be a “lock-down” or gated and secured facility. Therefore, the security plan consists of the regimented daily routine and class schedule for students, the statement by the applicant that all employees act as security personnel and the fact that a designated security officer is on duty at all times. With the concurrence of the applicant, facility operation measures have been made on-going conditions of approval. These measures include requirements that all students receive a medical “drug free” clearance before attending Narconon Warner Springs, that all visitors be approved by staff, and that all students remain at the site and be accompanied by staff when going off-site for any reason. The applicant has stated that an evening staff of three personnel on-site is adequate and appropriate for their program. There are no staffing ratio standards directed by The Zoning Ordinance for these types of facilities and the Planning Commission did not require the applicant to house additional staff on-site. A condition of approval does however require a 6-month and 12-month review of the facility after operation, to evaluate input from the local fire and sheriff departments as well as any complaints received by the Department of Planning and Land Use (DPLU) regarding operation and security. The Director of DPLU would file a report with the Planning Commission if the evaluation shows violations of use permit conditions or a threat to security in the area.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 21, 2012, 21:50
Good! Sorry I misunderstood. Thanks for the clarification and your good work!
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 21, 2012, 22:53
If one of the requirements to be admitted to Warner Springs is the client must have a medical drug free clearance, why do they have a sauna?
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 21, 2012, 23:41
If one of the requirements to be admitted to Warner Springs is the client must have a medical drug free clearance, why do they have a sauna?

The sauna stage is later, after withdrawal and come of the other stept. The sauna is to 'rid the body of toxins' - Hubbard's Clear Body Clear Mind' baloney
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on April 22, 2012, 00:13
Thanks for the info, Sunshine.

3. The following security measures shall be in force at all times:
a. There will be no students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility that are medically dependent, or that would potentially need emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol.


It's unfortunate that the clause is in there about "emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol," because the "students" might need emergency care not related to withdrawal, but related to the sauna, for instance, from heatstroke or dehydration.

Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 22, 2012, 00:16
Thanks for the info, Sunshine.

3. The following security measures shall be in force at all times:
a. There will be no students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility that are medically dependent, or that would potentially need emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol.


It's unfortunate that the clause is in there about "emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol," because the "students" might need emergency care not related to withdrawal, but related to the sauna, for instance, from heatstroke or dehydration.

The sauna is not used in withdrawal
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on April 22, 2012, 00:22
Thanks for the info, Sunshine.

3. The following security measures shall be in force at all times:
a. There will be no students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility that are medically dependent, or that would potentially need emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol.


It's unfortunate that the clause is in there about "emergency medical care for withdrawal from drugs or alcohol," because the "students" might need emergency care not related to withdrawal, but related to the sauna, for instance, from heatstroke or dehydration.

The sauna is not used in withdrawal

I know, that's why I'm saying it's unfortunate the clause is in there.  The sauna can result in medical emergencies not related to withdrawal, but still requiring emergency care. 

It would be better if it said "There will be no students at the Narconon Warner Springs facility that are medically dependent, or that would potentially need emergency medical care related to the program."   :)
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 22, 2012, 10:38
I guess you need to define what is meant by a medical drug free clearance, to me the individual has been examined by a qualified doctor and has no drugs it their system, therefore no need for the sauna.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on April 22, 2012, 11:20
I guess you need to define what is meant by a medical drug free clearance, to me the individual has been examined by a qualified doctor and has no drugs it their system, therefore no need for the sauna.

Yes, but Scientology believes these toxins stay in the system for years later.

Quote
How The Narconon® Program Handles Drug Cravings

Physical drug cravings often brought on by environmental factors are one of the number one reasons for relapse. In most cases, after a few days or weeks drugs can become untraceable in both the urine and blood. However there are drug metabolites that store in the fatty tissue of the body which can remain there for several years after a person stops using. Because these metabolites can re-release into the blood stream and cause physical drug cravings and other symptoms a program was founded to help rid the body of these toxins.

From NN Arrowhead site
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 22, 2012, 11:41
If that is the case then they are not drug free and should not be at Narconon Fresh Start Warner Springs.

Narconon states that drugs can reside in the body for years and to remove the drug residue requires their sauna detox program.  Does anyone know how they test the individual to determine if they are drug free?
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on April 22, 2012, 12:32
I believe they just use the regular purchased drug test kits, but I'm not sure.  (Maybe David Love can weigh in, he might know.)

NN is so unscientific!  They talk about metabolites, and yet, metabolites are what the drug tests test for.  I guess the tests can't detect the "super-duper-invisible metabolites" (SDI-metabolites) that Hubbard says stay in the body for years.

Another question might be: How do they determine that the sauna has removed all of these SDI-metabolites if the tests won't detect them?  Hmmm, NN?

Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Cigul on April 23, 2012, 04:01
I was at Warner Springs (AKA) Sunshine Summit Lodge from April to October 2011 (yes, btw, I was there for the inspection that led to the deficiency report). I was there as student and staff. They use a five panel dip test for the usual suspects and as I recall a separate test for Suboxone. These are the same urine drug tests that anyone can purchase at any pharmacy. There was no fancy equipment/drug screens used at any time to measure drug residue found in sweat. They did not measure that at anytime to my knowledge, nor did I ever see any equipment that could have been used to do so.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on April 23, 2012, 07:13
I was at Warner Springs (AKA) Sunshine Summit Lodge from April to October 2011 (yes, btw, I was there for the inspection that led to the deficiency report). I was there as student and staff. They use a five panel dip test for the usual suspects and as I recall a separate test for Suboxone. These are the same urine drug tests that anyone can purchase at any pharmacy. There was no fancy equipment/drug screens used at any time to measure drug residue found in sweat. They did not measure that at anytime to my knowledge, nor did I ever see any equipment that could have been used to do so.

Welcome to TP, Cigul - it's great to have your input!  Thanks for clarifying how they do their drug tests.   

Based on your experience there, would you say that the deficiency report was accurate?

Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 23, 2012, 10:28
Hi Cigul,
Thanks for the information, so how did they determine an individual was drug free?
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Cigul on April 23, 2012, 15:34
In regards to the first question: absolutely the deficiency report was accurate. It would take a lengthy reply to go point by point but let it suffice to say that the rooms and buildings were typically filthy and in poor repair and food storage was far from sanitary. And the inspection came on a good day. It wasn't long after that the plumbing failed and raw sewage was flowing in the walkways. I also know that all staff had to immediately get physicals and TB tests. So, yes. Quite accurate.

As to Sunshine's question, if I understand it correctly: UA's were given randomly to staff and students to ensure that there was no ongoing drug use. These had nothing to do with sauna itself. The sauna "tech" explained that niacin is a kind of magic vitamin that will "run out" radiation, drug residuals, illness, old sunburns or injuries, etc. A person would start at 200 mgs of niacin. If they had no reaction, the next day they would take 300, and so on. Let's say one begins to react (flushing, burning, itching) at 400 mg. They would take the same dose until They stopped reacting. Then they would go up another 100 mg. The reaction is seen as the niacin busting up and ridding the body of toxins. The tech says "what turns it on turns it off." So one.continues to take more and more niacin until there ceases to be any reaction (for most this happens at 2500mg but I saw students go up as high as 5000 mg. Once the reaction has stopped, the person is considered free of all drug residuals. That is how they measure it. With a quack theory that most doctors would laugh out of town. There is no actual, scientific process for measuring.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Sunshine on April 23, 2012, 16:00
Thanks for explaining the process to me; it’s interesting that you mentioned the raw sewage, inadequate septic system was one of the appeal items presented to the Board of Supervisors during their Major Use Permit hearing.

If possible could you commit on the number of staff and clients that were at the facility and did you live onsite?
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: BigBeard on April 24, 2012, 06:34
Cigul,

What you describe sounds like the victim/student's body is building up a tolerance to the lower dose, so they jack up the dose to get the symptoms of excess niacin going again. Those symptoms being:

Quote
Risks Of Using Excess Niacin

Excess intake of vitamin B3 or Niacin can cuase acute flushing, stomachache, headache, and chronic toxicity can occur causing, or increasing the risk of, diabetes, liver damage, gastritis, possibly gout, and eye damage.

High dosages of niacin can have sever gastrointestinal side effects like:

    Diarrhea
    Bloating
    Nausea
    Flatulence

Sudden drop in blood pressure can be caused due to high dose of niacin.

Long term side effects can damage vital organs of the body. Such side effects include:

    Liver disorders (hepatoxicity) within a few weeks
    Jaundice
    Peptic ulcer
    Blurred vision
    Dry or scaly skin
    Peptic ulcer

Or put another way, El Ron took the symptoms resulting from a niacin overdose, and claimed they were the signs his bogus 'purification/drug removal' program was working. Talk about a scam!
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on April 24, 2012, 23:32
Good informative thread!
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Cigul on April 25, 2012, 05:21
BigBeard,

Scam, indeed! In "Clear Body/Clear Mind" (required reading for students prior to beginning sauna) Hubbard writes of personally observing a case where, in sauna, the niacin "turned on" a "full-blown" case of skin cancer, which, with continued administration of niacin and sauna, was subsequently "run out" and cured. "What turns it on, turns it off," after all.
Hubbard with his usual flair for grandiose delusion actually claimed to cure cancer with niacin and sauna. It almost makes sweating out drug residuals believable, by comparison. Almost only not, of course. But he did indeed have some far out ideas about what niacin could do and of course despite years of actual, replicable, peer reviewed scientific research, Narconon staff cannot argue or alter the tech as that would be tantamount to heresy. So not only do you have addicts with already compromised liver function risking further damage with outrageously and dangerously high doses of niacin given daily, but the GI side effects such as vomiting and diarrhea were daily experiences for every student in sauna. I was personally in sauna with another student who was an insulin-dependent diabetic and should have NEVER been taking such doses of niacin given its effects on blood sugar (although "Dr" Sossin must have approved it). And my personal favorite, and by favorite I mean terrifying, observation was of a fellow student who clearly had schizophrenia (as evidenced by delusional thinking, responding to internal stimuli, ie, looking at and speaking to others who were not present, loose associations resulting in nearly incoherent speech patterns, etc) who was in sauna for nearly two months taking ridiculous amounts of niacin daily because the Narconon staff (none of whom with any medical training of course) were following the tech, which indicated that her hallucinations were turned on by the niacin and thus must be run through and turned off by continuing administration of niacin and sauna. Given my profession (psychologist) and my expertise (I actually specialized in treatment of schizophrenia) I tried to indicate to staff that this student was NOT appropriate for the Narconon program and that it was medically impossible for her to sweat out schizophrenia in the sauna. Those appeals fell on deaf ears naturally because, as not just a wog but also a nazi-psych wog, I was the one mistaken in my belief that there was such an illness as schizophrenia. To this day I've no idea how they managed to not seriously injure and/or kill the students with diabetes and schizophrenia and really who knows about any long term organ damage that might have occurred. Not only a scam BigBeard, but truly a daily miracle that the Purif doesn't claim more lives.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: BigBeard on April 25, 2012, 07:00
Unfortunately, I'm beginning to believe it's going to take more deaths before the Feds get off the dime and set up national standards for detox/rehab facilities. Including having trained medical staff on site.

I've been writing Congress critters about this for some time, but it seems to fall on deaf ears. Maybe when the U.S. side of NarCONon gets dragged in to Canadian court it'll get someones attention on Capital Hill.


Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on April 25, 2012, 07:15
A miracle indeed Cigul. The illnesses and deaths we know about are probably just the tip of the iceberg.

Narconon is marketing their program to dual diagnosis clients. Ugh! BigBeard is right. The Feds need to get involved and take action.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: SocialTransparency on April 25, 2012, 09:17
A miracle indeed Cigul. The illnesses and deaths we know about are probably just the tip of the iceberg.

BigBeard is right. The Feds need to get involved and take action.


 May take hiring legal entities to "Force" the state/fed to do something. The laws are on the books. It may take a different style of love to get the man off his ass!
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Cooper on February 23, 2013, 14:13
I just looked at the website for Sunshine Summit Lodge I was their in Jan and Feb of 2010.  The website is a completely false view of what the place is like.  The whole time I was their the Hot tub never worked.  The place was littered with cigarette butts.  It shows all these beautiful people in the pictures happy and smiling.  The most far from the truth were the picture of people in Chef Coats looking like they are ready to cook you the five star meal in the picture.  Much different from the one guy who had to cook each meal almost every day (former student of course) who I would smoke a cigarette with in the morning.  He never smiled.  I remember the laundry room being flooded only a few washer and dryers would work.  They would run out of laundry detergent often.  Oh buy the way they don't tell you that you will be the one of the people washing the towels each night after sauna.  You wash you're own sheets and bedding which is in horrible condition when you get them.  The blanket was so thin I had never even seen anything like it.  After reading the report and remembering all the things their it pissed me enough to want to register and post here after looking at their new website.  They don't tell you that you will be responsible for all the cleaning while the staff just sits on their ass and smokes cigarettes.  Then you pick up or empty their butts into the trash later.  I couldn't believe they were able to operate with the facility in such need of repair.  I never seen anything fixed unless it was done by a current or former student, or someone on ethics.  They also had one student who they had worked it out where he could do his community service while he was there.  It worked out perfect since it was obvious to me they didn't want to spend any money on the place.  It didn't look like the type of place people pay 30,000 dollars to go to.

Former Narconon "student" just making sure people know the truth about Narconon.  I was scammed into it like many others. 
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: snippy on February 23, 2013, 14:31
Cooper -

Welcome! From your first hand account, one thing is very clear. If these staff ever did give a damn, they sure don't anymore. Very sad for everyone involved, but especially for the patients, who desperately need someone to care. Obviously, the $30,000 isn't going toward people's treatment. Congrats to you for surviving the place.
 
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Cigul on February 23, 2013, 15:01
I second Snippy's welcome and his congratulations on surviving sunshine summit lodge. I too was student (and unfortunately staff) there from March 2011-October 2011. We would probably have much to talk about!
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on February 23, 2013, 16:34
I just looked at the website for Sunshine Summit Lodge I was their in Jan and Feb of 2010.  The website is a completely false view of what the place is like.  The whole time I was their the Hot tub never worked.  The place was littered with cigarette butts.  It shows all these beautiful people in the pictures happy and smiling.  The most far from the truth were the picture of people in Chef Coats looking like they are ready to cook you the five star meal in the picture.  Much different from the one guy who had to cook each meal almost every day (former student of course) who I would smoke a cigarette with in the morning.  He never smiled.  I remember the laundry room being flooded only a few washer and dryers would work.  They would run out of laundry detergent often.  Oh buy the way they don't tell you that you will be the one of the people washing the towels each night after sauna.  You wash you're own sheets and bedding which is in horrible condition when you get them.  The blanket was so thin I had never even seen anything like it.  After reading the report and remembering all the things their it pissed me enough to want to register and post here after looking at their new website.  They don't tell you that you will be responsible for all the cleaning while the staff just sits on their ass and smokes cigarettes.  Then you pick up or empty their butts into the trash later.  I couldn't believe they were able to operate with the facility in such need of repair.  I never seen anything fixed unless it was done by a current or former student, or someone on ethics.  They also had one student who they had worked it out where he could do his community service while he was there.  It worked out perfect since it was obvious to me they didn't want to spend any money on the place.  It didn't look like the type of place people pay 30,000 dollars to go to.

Former Narconon "student" just making sure people know the truth about Narconon.  I was scammed into it like many others.

As I stated in the Lucas Catton book thread, thank you so much for writing about your experience at Narconon. This will help many people.
Looking forward to future comments and insights fro you.

Thank you!!

Mary
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: mefree on February 23, 2013, 21:36
Cooper, thanks for sharing your experience with us.

 :w:e:l:c:o:m:e: to Tipping Point.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: ethercat on February 24, 2013, 09:57
Cooper, welcome to the Tipping Point. 

It would be great if you did the Narconon Survey - it's not done by Narconon, but by some independent researchers.  The link is http://reachingforthetippingpoint.net/narcononsurvey (http://reachingforthetippingpoint.net/narcononsurvey).
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Cooper on February 24, 2013, 12:42
Thanks ethercat,

I did the survey about a week ago.  I stayed for a little while at Narconon Newport beach before going to Warner Springs.  It was in January of 2010 I was suppose to do just Non Med detox however ended up staying because they didn't have room at Warner.  So I did everything up until Sauna in Newport.  When they explained everything originally they never told me Newport was closing. So of course that place was a dump too.  I remember getting all packed once too leave and then they told us we had to stay longer.  They had me and my twin teach book 1 to people coming out of detox since they wouldn't let us move on with our program.  They said we had to wait and start sauna at Warner.  So instead of moving on with my treatment I started teaching the program and continued to clean the place.  I soon found out it was over crowed at Warner because of Newport closing and they didn't nearly have enough staff too handle the students. Plus they had to wait for beds too open.
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: Mary_McConnell on February 24, 2013, 12:47
Thanks ethercat,

I did the survey about a week ago.  I stayed for a little while at Narconon Newport beach before going to Warner Springs.  It was in January of 2010 I was suppose to do just Non Med detox however ended up staying because they didn't have room at Warner.  So I did everything up until Sauna in Newport.  When they explained everything originally they never told me Newport was closing. So of course that place was a dump too.  I remember getting all packed once too leave and then they told us we had to stay longer.  They had me and my twin teach book 1 to people coming out of detox since they wouldn't let us move on with our program.  They said we had to wait and start sauna at Warner.  So instead of moving on with my treatment I started teaching the program and continued to clean the place.  I soon found out it was over crowed at Warner because of Newport closing and they didn't nearly have enough staff too handle the students. Plus they had to wait for beds too open.

Wow! You were there at Newport at the end! It took much effort on the part of people to get that facility closed. I did my part, getting victim affidavits into the council hearings. I sent lots of reports and documents on how they'd gotten their facility illegally licensed. There was a whole group of prople out there trying for years to close them down and finally it happened. No license renewal. So sorry you had to endure the program and transition mess. Thanks for speaking up on this! 
Title: Re: Sunshine Summit Lodge Narconon is Dirty and Unsafe
Post by: SocialTransparency on February 25, 2013, 09:38
Thanks ethercat,

I did the survey about a week ago.  I stayed for a little while at Narconon Newport beach before going to Warner Springs.  It was in January of 2010 I was suppose to do just Non Med detox however ended up staying because they didn't have room at Warner.  So I did everything up until Sauna in Newport.  When they explained everything originally they never told me Newport was closing. So of course that place was a dump too.  I remember getting all packed once too leave and then they told us we had to stay longer.  They had me and my twin teach book 1 to people coming out of detox since they wouldn't let us move on with our program.  They said we had to wait and start sauna at Warner.  So instead of moving on with my treatment I started teaching the program and continued to clean the place.  I soon found out it was over crowed at Warner because of Newport closing and they didn't nearly have enough staff too handle the students. Plus they had to wait for beds too open.

 Welcome to RFTTP cooper. Seriously happy in hearing what you have to say.