Reaching For the Tipping Point

Narconon and Other Scientology Front Groups => Narconon in California => Topic started by: NarcononHater on December 14, 2013, 20:20

Title: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 14, 2013, 20:20
I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out, ask me anything.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: ethercat on December 14, 2013, 20:37
Welcome to Tipping Point, NarcononHater. 

Why did you get kicked out, and how long were you there before they did it?
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 14, 2013, 20:59
I was there for 2 months before they kicked me out.

I thought I was kicked out for supposedly "denouncing Scientology." My father later told me he thinks they kicked me out because he was insisting to come and visit the place. They wouldn't let him and it was getting really weird.

Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: ethercat on December 14, 2013, 21:04
Hahaha!  Probably for both.  They knew that was trouble, LOL.

When they kicked you out, did they drop you at a hotel or homeless shelter?  Or just call your dad to come get you?
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 14, 2013, 21:42
 :w:e:l:c:o:m:e:!!

So glad you have come here to speak up. Anything you can share about your experience that won't give away your identity would be helpful.

Can you tell us what year you were there?


This video was leaked recently. It's a staff video, not meant for public. Someone got a hold of it and posted it on the internet. So glad they did.

I think you may find it cathartic in some way. These people are crazy and you will see here how they really feel about their jobs.

Narconon Vista Bay ED Video 2011 Excerpt
http://rutube.ru/video/4a540398e5981f6ef7d5d03116563b2d/
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 14, 2013, 22:54
When they kicked you out, did they drop you at a hotel or homeless shelter?  Or just call your dad to come get you?

- They drove me back to a house where a few staff members live. It was a really nice house. I spent the night there and was dropped off at a train station to go back home. I am scared of airplanes lol.

Can you tell us what year you were there?

- I would rather not say what year I was there b/c they threatened to sue me if I spoke out about my experience there. They even had me sign some papers about it when they issued a partial refund.

This video was leaked recently. It's a staff video, not meant for public. Someone got a hold of it and posted it on the internet. So glad they did. I think you may find it cathartic in some way. These people are crazy and you will see here how they really feel about their jobs.

- Thanks for sending me this. I saw a shorter version of this on youtube, it wasn't 20 minutes maybe 5 minutes at most. This video is disgusting. I know all of the people in the video. Every "staff" member that works there is so brainwashed its not even funny. No one can think for themselves. It really makes me sick seeing this video as I totally get everything they are saying and doing. I'm kinda surprised they would have made this video as they all are so fake and are scared of getting ratted out by each other. I showed the clip of the video I found on youtube to my parents and they were shocked. They were pretty mad about it. My parents really dont like to talk about it b/c they feel like they were conned. Both of my parents are super hard working people and $30,000 was a lot of money to just waste. My dad has actually sent letters to California schools telling them not to allow Narconon in their schools. I found out he did that after showing him this video. I was so surprised my dad did that as thats not something I can see him doing.


Keep the questions coming, even if its something personal or possibly revealing. If its revealing the worst I will do is explain why I won't answer the question.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: source on December 15, 2013, 01:57
1). Do you feel you were lied to?  If so, describe.
2) Were you informed about the scientology connection upfront.  How did they handle this?
3) Did you witness any unprofessional or unethical acts from staff? 
4) Your opinions on their advertised success rate.
5) What was the overall culture like there and what were the opinions of the fellow students?
6) Did you feel that it was a drug free facility?  Did you feel that the staff were drug and alcohol free?
7) How adequately did they separate the men from the women?

Welcome here, btw.  You'll probably find it quite therapeutic to talk/write/vent. You'll find that shifting from a victim to an advocate can be a rather empowering experience.

Just because you're an addict/alcoholic doesn't give someone the right to take advantage of you.  God knows most have done a pretty good job of doing that to themselves.

You'll find your experiences are the same as hundreds.  It's just that most are struggling with an untreated addiction after NARCONON failed to work, that coming here isn't exactly a priority.  It kind of sucks to realize that you got conned by something you thought was a legitimate treatment.  Many people give up trying after a bad experience like that.

Glad you're here.  A lot of people have died trying to believe in the lies NARCONON told them.  Wait til you've been out a year and reach out to the students you met at NARCONON, and realize that none of them stayed clean.

Wait til you realize how many overdosed after NARCONON. 
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 15, 2013, 07:53
1). Do you feel you were lied to?  If so, describe.
Holy shit thats what started my distrust with the place in the beginning. Wow where to begin?! They told me I would be detoxed with medication and there would be a highly trained medical staff on site. When I got there that changed and I had to sit in this cabin detoxing with no medical supervision whatsoever. I never once saw a doctor. I couldn't fall asleep for 8 days straight. I had restless leg syndrome the whole entire time, it was insane. So the lieing about the medical detox was the first thing.

One night in the detox cabin the cook came up to cabin to just chill. We got to talking and he told me  how they (narconon) told a client he could bring his surfboard to go surfing and all this different stuff. I guess the client shows up with all of this stuff he wasnt allowed to use. Basically they told him a bunch of lies to get him there. And I remembered they did the same to me. B/c before I even got there they told me great stuff about this place. We could go to the beach, go into town and go shopping, movies, etc. None of that was allowed. So I was like wtf? They told my parents we could get reimbursed by our insurance company for the treatment, that was a lie. They would tell my parents things I never said. They would tell them how fine and happy I was, which obviously I wasn't. They would call me into a room and interrogate me, telling me I said stuff I never said. They said if I leave there was no way I could get a refund b/c of the papers I signed (not true got 10,000 back but still a ripoff). There are probably so many lies I can't remember right now. Its finals week and I'm pulling an all nighter studying so when I remember more I will come back and post them.
2) Were you informed about the scientology connection upfront.  How did they handle this?

My parents nor me were ever informed about the Scientology connection. I went to a private school and senior year we learned about all different religions. One of them was Scientology. So the last day I was in detox they hand me this book and say this is the next part of the program, read this and practice. I was thinking practice what? I opened it up and saw L RON HUBBARD. I was like wtf Scientology? I get out of the detox cabin and integrate into where everyone is. I walk into the place and see a huge picture of L RON HUBBARD. So at this point I'm starting to think wtf is this place but I'm really not to worried as everyone was super friendly and having fun. Then I had to start doing these classes, these drills. L Ron Hubbard books filled with crazy weird shit. After the first 3 hours of reading the book and doing the drills I just walked out of the room. For 4 days they kept trying to get me to do these drills but I wouldn't go to the class. They had people constantly bugging me, talking to me. They were telling my parents this whole time that I wanted to leave and go use drugs, that I actually said that. They were telling my parents all sorts of lies (I didn't know this at the time). I eventually ended up finishing the drills b/c I didn't want to hurt/stress my parents out, b/c they wouldn't believe me. I had to finish these drills to get into the sauna program. Everyone was raving about, how they could sleep, and they felt so much better. I get to the sauna program and after the first week I feel like they are trying to torture me. They tried to force me to drink this vinegar, magnesium, drink that instantly made me throw up. I tried but I couldnt down it. I soon realized they weren't going to let me pass the sauna program until I complied with all their bullshit. One day I was in the sauna for so long that I got extremely light headed, like i was worried for my safety. So I went outside to cool off and gather myself, they started yelling at me to get back inside the sauna, I told them my condition and they said you'll push through it get back in there. Thats another polarizing moment when I was like wtf, these people dont have my interests at heart. They sent me to the ethics place for not going back into the sauna and talking back to the sauna baby sitter. I explained myself and was still penalized. Thats when I called a friend from back home whos a computer nerd and told him to look this place up on the internet. I talk to him the next day and he tells me all kinds of shit. He asked me if I knew who Daniel Manson(?) was, and he was the main guy in charge of the facility. He was charged with raping a girl!
3) Did you witness any unprofessional or unethical acts from staff?

So many I can't even count. The female staff members would have sex with multiple male staff members. There was a lot of drama like that. Lots of sex, lots. The whole place was unprofessional I can't even begin where to start there, all the staff members are only 90 days clean. The staff would go out drinking and I'd hear stories about it.
Narconon doesn't believe in prescription medicine. There were old people there and they would take them off of all their heart medications, etc, without a doctor. I realized really quickly that most of the people there would act really nice and be pretty cool but they weren't concerned for anyones health. Everyone was totally brainwashed.
I remember I would think of little theories about what this whole Narconon place is and what their motives were. When I finally got home I searched the internet and all the theories I came up with when I was there were true! I was 100% correct but when I was there I sometimes would doubt myself, I would say to myself your just conspiracing.
Basically everything was unprofessional and there was so much unethical stuff I can't even remember it all. The only professional part was how they get you there. They are insanely good at recruiting people to come there, I will give them credit for that. They also are insanely good at brainwashing people. I still haven't figured the psychology around how they do it, but its genius. No one there could think for themselves.
 
4) Your opinions on their advertised success rate.

LOOOOOL. 85%-90%! So many staff members have quit working there since I was there. I have reached out and contacted them to talk. They all finally admitted to me that everything there is bullshit. They would admit to me that I was right the whole time! I would ask them if they were ever recruited to offically join scientology and i heard those stories. sadly, a ton of the ex-employees are using drugs. I can see it in on their social media accounts as well as they will admit.

As for other "students" pretty much every person I was there with, except 1 person relapsed. One guy my age, 22, quit his $200k per year job to work there. He was brainwashed. He relapsed, was sent back to narconon, and ended up converting. Most people end up staying and working for them. A lot of older people just walk out and quit.
5) What was the overall culture like there and what were the opinions of the fellow students?

The culture was like a sober party. Lots of joking and messing around. Lots of truth or dare with the girls. Lots of sex. Everyones really nice and talkative. And then everyone figures out the truth, we are at a scientology center. everyone is hush hush about it b/c they intimidate you. they interview people and try to get people to rat each other out. they turn students into "informants." I found out they brought a staff member from another center to pose as a "student" from my hometown to see what i would say.

the drills would cause people to go crazy. one guy took off all of his clothes, and was butt naked from doing those drills for 6 hours straight.

some people are gun-ho about it. thinking what they are doing is actually good. for a few days i was like this b/c i kept telling myself all of this was good, i was literally fighting my conscious.

6) Did you feel that it was a drug free facility?  Did you feel that the staff were drug and alcohol free?

The staff were 100% not drug and alcohol free, FACT.

When I was there, living at the facility, the students for the most part were clean. There was a girl that got kicked out, or shipped to another facility, b/c she smuggled drugs through the mail and someone ratted her out.

Later on in the program you can move into an apartment, off site, in the city, with other students and staff members. this is where most of the drug use would go down. i didn't make it that far.

7) How adequately did they separate the men from the women?

There was no seperation whatsoever.
We all did the sauna together in the same saunas.
We took our 5 minute sauna breaks together.
The girls rooms were easy to get to. Narconon Vista Bay is just a ranch-style mansion. Its huge. Its open air.
One of my thoughts when I was there, is they want you to get hooked up with a girl when your there so you'll stay in the program together. All the girl staff members date guy staff members.


I know I went off topic a lot! Theres so much I wish I could remember. I will elaborate on anything, just ask if you are curious about something just ask.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 15, 2013, 11:04
Thanks so much for taking the time to reply here during finals. Unfortunately, your story is ver familiar and similar to many others.

Do you feel like you were harmed by your experience there? Physically or emotionally?

Thanks, again.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Escapee on December 15, 2013, 13:34
it surprises me how similar my experiences were and the centers are thousands of miles away...just reinforces why they should be closed everywhere around the world, I'm interested in the field of recovery and have done a little research on different drug rehabs and none have a network of people out there trying to shut them down like narconon!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: source on December 15, 2013, 14:48
I've heard from a handful of people who got into real treatment as a profession, that their experiences at NARCONON did help them because they learned so much of what not to do.

For example, there is a reason they separate the sexes, don't hire newly sober people to run the place, don't allow dating of clients, etc.

All of the mistakes the early treatment centers made and then introduced policy to handle, NARCONON is doing.  They are about 50 years behind the field.  And they don't take well to change.

So, I hope you find your goals and get into the field.  Narconon makes it attractive because they feel like you can take a one month course and be a counselor.  It takes a lot more than that in the real world, but you'll understand why.  Many people ended up working at NARCONON thinking it could get them into the field.  Later they discover that their training is ridiculous, ineffective, harmful, etc.  And they can't even put it on their resume.

Glad you didn't get sucked into that trap.  You've been saved from the following uncomfortable moment during a job interview at a real rehab:

"So, according to your resume here, I see that you are able to sit in a chair with your eyes closed for hours at a time and can even compel ashtrays to move with your mind.  Tell me a little more about the time you spent 20 hours picking up a book and a bottle answering the question 'what is its weight?' about a thousand times.  And explain further about this idea that the sauna can remove radiation and that drugs are stored in your fatty tissues for years.  And I'm a little unclear about your philosophy to tell people in rehab to only drink in moderation.  Ahem."





Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 15, 2013, 14:54
Do you feel like you were harmed by your experience there? Physically or emotionally?

I feel like I was put in harms way when I was there. Thank God nothing happened to me. I was really worried for the old people there who were taken off of their important medications. Besides the time when they tried to force me to get back into the sauna, when I was about to faint, I would say no physical harm.

I can say I was harmed emotionally. After my Narconon experience I no longer had trust in rehab centers or doctors. I constantly felt like I let my parents down, that I wasted $30,000 of their money. Luckily my parents finally realized how bad this place was and anytime the subject is brought up they apologize for ever sending me there. I try to stress to them its not their fault. Narconon runs the PERFECT scam. They are so good at getting you to come there its mind blowing. Its really hard to explain the emotional damage that was done. When I got home I saw a psychologist just to talk about the Narconon experience. Luckily I have stayed clean on my own, no NA/AA. I have 1 more semester of university. I graduate this  coming May. I'm thankful I stayed true to myself and didn't fall for their "recruitment and brainwashing." A lot of people that go there do fall for it, and I totally see how. I hope the people that stay at Narconon make it out of there without wasting years and years of their life.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 15, 2013, 15:04
Narconon makes it attractive because they feel like you can take a one month course and be a counselor.  It takes a lot more than that in the real world, but you'll understand why.  Many people ended up working at NARCONON thinking it could get them into the field.  Later they discover that their training is ridiculous, ineffective, harmful, etc.  And they can't even put it on their resume.


When I was in the detox cabin, this is one of the first red flags. They would accept anyone who graduated the program to work and live there. I remember thinking that is strange.


I want to add one thing about the emotional harm that was done. My parents went through a ton of emotional distress. They felt so bad for sending me there. They felt conned. They felt really stupid that fell for their marketing. My parents were just trying to get me help as quick as possible and never considered that such a place could exist. I feel really bad for putting my family into that position.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Escapee on December 15, 2013, 15:05



So, I hope you find your goals and get into the field.  Narconon makes it attractive because they feel like you can take a one month course and be a counselor.  It
"So, according to your resume here, I see that you are able to sit in a chair with your eyes closed for hours at a time and can even compel ashtrays to move with your mind.  Tell me a little more about the time you spent 20 hours picking up a book and a bottle answering the question 'what is its weight?' about a thousand times.  And explain further about this idea that the sauna can remove radiation and that drugs are stored in your fatty tissues for years.  And I'm a little unclear about your philosophy to tell people in rehab to only drink in moderation.  Ahem."
[/quote
Man obj 11 lol bringing back some crazy memories lol also obj 8 ha ha thanks for those words of encouragement
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 15, 2013, 23:35
You make a good point. I'm going to ask some former Narconon employees if they put their work experience on job resumes. A lot of them worked their for years and years.

Narconon wouldn't let me bring home the course books we used to do those crazy drills. When I got out of Narconon I did a search on a popular torrent website and found a PDF file that contained all of the books. I downloaded it and saved it but I lost the thumb drive I put the files on. Would anyone happen to have them?
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 15, 2013, 23:39
Sorry I have not been able to come back and thoughtfully reply to you NarcononHater. Give me until tomorrow evening, Eastern Standard time. I've just have too much on my plate this weekend.

Mary
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 16, 2013, 07:35
NarcononHater, you mention at least two harms that I find particularly disturbing. 1) being turned-off to the idea of ever returning to rehab, and 2) the guilt your parents are left with by sending you to Narconon.

It sounds like you are doing very well, but most people are going to need help to get clean. There are good, honest reputable programs available.

It is so very unfair that parents should suffer from the guilt of sending their kids to Rehab when they were simply trying to help their kids. Their trust was betrayed by Narconon.

Thanks for answering my questions.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Escapee on December 16, 2013, 08:21
You make a good point. I'm going to ask some former Narconon employees if they put their work experience on job resumes. A lot of them worked their for years and years.

Narconon wouldn't let me bring home the course books we used to do those crazy drills. When I got out of Narconon I did a search on a popular torrent website and found a PDF file that contained all of the books. I downloaded it and saved it but I lost the thumb drive I put the files on. Would anyone happen to have them?

I have every course book even the workbook for the sauna they just aren't on PDF they Are physical books
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: 10oriocookies on December 16, 2013, 17:09
You make a good point. I'm going to ask some former Narconon employees if they put their work experience on job resumes. A lot of them worked their for years and years.

Narconon wouldn't let me bring home the course books we used to do those crazy drills. When I got out of Narconon I did a search on a popular torrent website and found a PDF file that contained all of the books. I downloaded it and saved it but I lost the thumb drive I put the files on. Would anyone happen to have them?

I worked there for over a decade and was recently hired at a new job.  One of the things that got me hired, I believe, was the fact that I did and am doing something about the abuses.  I told them up front that they could contact NarCONon to verify employment and told them what they would say and why.  I directed them to the internet to verify my story and the website the "church" created to discredit me.  Apparently courage and honesty are more important than the fact that I was in a cult run drug rehab position.  Honesty is always the best policy and you can turn this "negative" experience into a positive.  I am living proof.  I am getting paid to help people again, something I would gladly do for free and Im doing it in a legitimate place.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: 10oriocookies on December 16, 2013, 17:15
Do you feel like you were harmed by your experience there? Physically or emotionally?

I feel like I was put in harms way when I was there. Thank God nothing happened to me. I was really worried for the old people there who were taken off of their important medications. Besides the time when they tried to force me to get back into the sauna, when I was about to faint, I would say no physical harm.

I can say I was harmed emotionally. After my Narconon experience I no longer had trust in rehab centers or doctors. I constantly felt like I let my parents down, that I wasted $30,000 of their money. Luckily my parents finally realized how bad this place was and anytime the subject is brought up they apologize for ever sending me there. I try to stress to them its not their fault. Narconon runs the PERFECT scam. They are so good at getting you to come there its mind blowing. Its really hard to explain the emotional damage that was done. When I got home I saw a psychologist just to talk about the Narconon experience. Luckily I have stayed clean on my own, no NA/AA. I have 1 more semester of university. I graduate this  coming May. I'm thankful I stayed true to myself and didn't fall for their "recruitment and brainwashing." A lot of people that go there do fall for it, and I totally see how. I hope the people that stay at Narconon make it out of there without wasting years and years of their life.

Please dont be turned off by your experience at NN.  Although you may be doing well now, your addiction can come back with a vengeance.  The bottom comes much quicker when you relapse, even faster as the false security of being "cured" by NN puts you at a higher risk of going even lower than you ever have.  Its either death, jail or institutions.  Trust me on this, go get some real help.  There are lots of resources on this site you can use.  Just ask and we will all help you.

Dont feel guilty for your parents being scammed.  This is the cults operating basis.  They are very good at it.  Its nothing to be ashamed of.  The most important thing in my opinion is that people who have gone through the program need to get real help, even if they are doing "good". 
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 16, 2013, 18:04
^^^^
This!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 16, 2013, 18:32
When they kicked you out, did they drop you at a hotel or homeless shelter?  Or just call your dad to come get you?

- They drove me back to a house where a few staff members live. It was a really nice house. I spent the night there and was dropped off at a train station to go back home. I am scared of airplanes lol.

Can you tell us what year you were there?

- I would rather not say what year I was there b/c they threatened to sue me if I spoke out about my experience there. They even had me sign some papers about it when they issued a partial refund.

This video was leaked recently. It's a staff video, not meant for public. Someone got a hold of it and posted it on the internet. So glad they did. I think you may find it cathartic in some way. These people are crazy and you will see here how they really feel about their jobs.

- Thanks for sending me this. I saw a shorter version of this on youtube, it wasn't 20 minutes maybe 5 minutes at most. This video is disgusting. I know all of the people in the video. Every "staff" member that works there is so brainwashed its not even funny. No one can think for themselves. It really makes me sick seeing this video as I totally get everything they are saying and doing. I'm kinda surprised they would have made this video as they all are so fake and are scared of getting ratted out by each other. I showed the clip of the video I found on youtube to my parents and they were shocked. They were pretty mad about it. My parents really dont like to talk about it b/c they feel like they were conned. Both of my parents are super hard working people and $30,000 was a lot of money to just waste. My dad has actually sent letters to California schools telling them not to allow Narconon in their schools. I found out he did that after showing him this video. I was so surprised my dad did that as thats not something I can see him doing.


Keep the questions coming, even if its something personal or possibly revealing. If its revealing the worst I will do is explain why I won't answer the question.

Hi, Thanks for your replies, above. I certainly understand on both. Kudos to your father! We love it when people use their experience to then help others beware!!

I received some tips lately about Vista Bay. They are trying to get CARF accreditation and had an assessment visit the other day. Just before the visit, 4 staff quit!

Am awaiting information on how the assessment went. They have to lie to get CARF accredited. Only one Narconon is CARF accredited and that was because they had help from an insider.  The same guy trying to help Vista Bay get accredited. Perhaps staff left because they refused to cooperation in the fudging of records and such? I'm waiting for more info.

This is the process.
http://www.carf.org/Accreditation/AccreditationProcess/StepstoAccreditation/

Perhaps you can send  complaint to CARF?

If you do, make sure you mention that they are in the application process and you want them to know first hand your experience. You can do it confidentially or not.

How to submit feedback or resolve a complaint with a CARF-accredited provider
http://www.carf.org/How_to_submit_feedback_and_resolve_a_complaint/

Thanks for speaking up here... your posts are helping others
Mary
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 16, 2013, 20:50
I did a google search for "Narconon Book Download." This website was the 2nd search result and it contained links to all books including the sauna book. I downloaded the books again and have them saved properly so I won't lose them. I never got to finish some books so I plan to go read through them.

Has anyone ever analyzed the purpose of these drills. I'm wondering if there is any literature out there where a psychologist or anyone for that matter try to figure out their purpose. My psychologist seemed to understand what they were trying to accomplish but I forget what he said now. I find it interesting.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: 10oriocookies on December 16, 2013, 21:07
I did a google search for "Narconon Book Download." This website was the 2nd search result and it contained links to all books including the sauna book. I downloaded the books again and have them saved properly so I won't lose them. I never got to finish some books so I plan to go read through them.

Has anyone ever analyzed the purpose of these drills. I'm wondering if there is any literature out there where a psychologist or anyone for that matter try to figure out their purpose. My psychologist seemed to understand what they were trying to accomplish but I forget what he said now. I find it interesting.

Those books are good for one thing: recycling.  Dont try to figure them out or do the exercises on your own.  Dont go over them with your psychologist as he is not as informed on the abuses of Narconon as someone who has been through it.  I personally have experience in delivering the program and getting real help from real professionals.  There is no comparison.  Its like taking your car to the barber to get the transmission changed.  Stupid.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: source on December 16, 2013, 23:02
Unfortunately, what much of those books are really about have little to do with addiction or recovery.

For example, books 1 and 4 (TRs) are really the basic training to be an auditor, where you must be trained to ask a preclear a question over and over without reacting, handling any originations as they come up.  Narconon tries to put a square peg in a round hole and explain to you that the TRs are really about confronting addiction, communicating and controlling yourself and your environment.  It isn't.  They know it, but sold you a different purpose.

It's sad because it's really a shell game.  Much of the info "seems" like it applies but when you start to understand what the purposes are in scientology, you will feel a bit ripped off.

It's kind of like someone handed you a manual on auto repair and said that it is really symbolic of addiction and recovery.  You might be able to connect some dots and come up with some really interesting "epiphanies" like "wow if I don't take care of myself today, I will start to break down later!  That's amazing"

But in reality, it's just about auto repair.

And the NARCONON program isn't built on parts that have anything to do with addiction.  Any realizations you came to were of your making as you were searching for answers.

And, sadly, you could have taken all of the courses you took at NARCONON for about $2000 total in a scientology Org, including the sauna and objectives.

If you take out the sauna, you could have had all the rest for about $500, I believe.

Not sure current prices, but that's what they were about 10 years ago.

Narconon was just a way to exponentially increase the cost of some very basic courses and take advantage of addicts. 
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 17, 2013, 04:49
I would never do those exercises lol. They caused me to go crazy.

Heres a few more things I remembered about my experience:

-I was scheduled to leave for Narconon on a certain date but it got pushed back 3 days. Narconon offered a $2,000 "scholarship" when we told them this. Basically their goal was to get me there as fast as possible and sign the papers. They didn't want us to find out what the place really was. I didn't take the scholarship and then they offered a free flight + $2000.

- One day I was talking to one of the staff and a girl who just got there. The staff member told me that lieing to people to get them to come to Narconon wasn't wrong and that it was ethical because in the end you are helping them.

-One thing that always pissed them off was when I asked them if they thought it was "ethical" that they take thousands and thousands of hard earned cash from families and then won't refund it if Narconon isn't the right fit for them. The word "ethical" is thrown around a lot at Narconon.

-Every 2 days or so a staff member would come around with pieces of paper and pens and they would ask you to write a "Win" on the piece of paper and sign it. I never did this because for one, I never learned a damn thing or had anything positive to say. But also I had this thought that they were doing this so that if you tried to sue them they would have a bunch positive testimonial with my signature on it. I always declined writing these things and they would really try to push it on me. I filled out 3 of them saying things like "Drugs are bad mmmkay?"


During the sauna program they would do something similar. I was in the sauna program for more than a month, every day spending 8 hours in the sauna. At the end of each day there was paper work you had to complete. I found out that everyone was "graduating" the sauna program but me. After awhile all the students caught on to what was going on so they would fill the paperwork out saying how good they feel, they feel like a new person, etc, just to get out of the sauna program because after awhile it starts to turn in to torture. You are punished for coming out of sauna too often. I would fill out the paper work being 100% honest. I had this realization that they were purposely keeping me in the sauna program, basically torturing me, until I wrote how great it was and provided a "testimonial."

When I get out of Narconon and was doing my research. I found out that Narconon would use these pieces of paperwork in their lawsuits. They would use it as documentation that you were getting stuff out of the program, etc.

One day at the sauna I was alone with one of the main narconon employees. His job is(was) to go to the California schools and give speeches to the kids about not doing drugs. He was a highly regarded college football player that was drafted by a NFL football team but screwed it up because of drugs. It was just me and him and I asked him about all the websites that are dedicated to exposing Narconon, and what the motive is behind them if this place is just trying to help people. I told him that there are no websites about other rehabs. His answer was that the pharmaceutical companies (Big Pharma) and psychiatrists are behind it because Narconon gets people off of all drugs even prescribed medications. He went on and on about how and why Big Pharma does this. (I try to avoid big pharma to and dont want to take any medication, but they are taking it way to far, taking people off of heart and blood medications with no doctors etc.)

- One thing I was concerned about when I was there was the amount of vitamins they forced us to consume. 30-40 multivitamins a day. They claimed that the vitamins were all water soluble so if your body didn't need them you would just piss the rest out. I picked up one of the jars of vitamins one day and it said take 1 vitamin daily lol. I'm not sure if what we were taking was toxic but a few websites said it was, I'm still unsure.

- They claimed all this crazy stuff about the Niacin and vitamin cocktails they made us consume like drug residuals would come to the top of our skin and turn it red. Obviously this is just a reaction to the niacin. They told everyone that people would get "high" from the niacin pushing the drug residuals stored in fat back into the bloodstream. So many people would act like they were having an acid flashback, nodding from heroin, speeding from meth. I never felt shit, and I think thats a down right lie. Hell some of the drugs arent even fat soluble lol! I started questioning the sauna program and all I got was bullshit answers, a bunch of "hill billy science." They sent me to talk to a higher up staff member. I asked if they could show me some peer reviewed articles about the sauna program and the science behind it. The higher up assured me he could and even promised to print it off so I could read it. They never printed me jack shit. The higher up explained the same "hill billy science" to me, I poked a lot of holes into what he was just from stuff i learned at university (I'm in the medical field).

- Everytime I used the pay phone one of the staff would stand by it and try to listen to what I was talking about. I think I already told you guys about the undercover staff member they brought who acted like another student from my city. I was using the phone and he came up and started to talk on the other phone. I could tell he was fake talking he was just there to monitor my phone call.

Another time I caught a staff member eavesdropping on my phone calls. There was a window to the staff conference room about 6 inches from where the pay phone was drilled into the wall. Behind the wall the payphone was screwed into was the staff conference room thingy. I was suspicious of eaves dropping b/c they called me in to question me about my thoughts and mentioned some things they couldn't have known. I peaked in the window and a staff member was against the wall by the window, on his knees listening LOL.

This is all I can remember for today. My hands are starting to hurt from typing. Some of this may sound like I'm crazy or paranoid or something but I assure you that is not the case. All of this is stuff that goes down at Narconon.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 17, 2013, 07:32

Quote
One day at the sauna I was alone with one of the main narconon employees. His job is(was) to go to the California schools and give speeches to the kids about not doing drugs. He was a highly regarded college football player that was drafted by a NFL football team but screwed it up because of drugs. It was just me and him and I asked him about all the websites that are dedicated to exposing Narconon, and what the motive is behind them if this place is just trying to help people. I told him that there are no websites about other rehabs. His answer was that the pharmaceutical companies (Big Pharma) and psychiatrists are behind it because Narconon gets people off of all drugs even prescribed medications. He went on and on about how and why Big Pharma does this. (I try to avoid big pharma to and dont want to take any medication, but they are taking it way to far, taking people off of heart and blood medications with no doctors etc.)

Hah! That sounds like Bob Adams. We have a few threads mentioning him around here.
http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php?action=search2
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Escapee on December 17, 2013, 11:26
Don't know if this applies in this thread, but I'm gonna say it anyways..I was in withdrawal and this guy came over from arrowhead, he was like some super Nn employee lol he told me he saw someone sweat out a bullet!! A damn bullet c'mon I'm coverd in tattoos an they didn't sweat out lol..anyways I got suspended some weeks later and got on the internet! To my surprise jay jay this superstar from arrowhead was on the Scientology website on video giving his success story lol.. A lil more reaserch led me to find out that this jay jay was under investigation for physically assaulting a student who left NARCONON..he was giving him an "assist" and left him seriously physically injured! I wonder what ever happens with that! Also I forget what website this story was on but there was photos my apologies

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Stop-Narconon/Personal/MichaelG/

Here is the link I found it..again sorry if this is the wrong place but I had to have this guy put me thru detox after this should he never ever to be able to work with people let alone addicts..
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: 10oriocookies on December 17, 2013, 17:01
I was there when the bullet came out of the kids face.  It wasnt because of the sauna though.  He had been shot prior to coming and a little piece came out.  This is a naturally occurring process I believe.  Nothing to do with the sauna.  Ive known JJ for 25 years as well.  You are correct, he and everyone else who works at NN shouldnt be.  Its pseudoscience, destructive and against what the real professionals have to say about addiction.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Escapee on December 17, 2013, 17:33
I was there when the bullet came out of the kids face.  It wasnt because of the sauna though.  He had been shot prior to coming and a little piece came out.  This is a naturally occurring process I believe.  Nothing to do with the sauna.  Ive known JJ for 25 years as well.  You are correct, he and everyone else who works at NN shouldnt be.  Its pseudoscience, destructive and against what the real professionals have to say about addiction.

Do you happen to know what ever happend with this guy jj over physically hurting this guy? He was ok with me but he had just had a heart surgery, so he was pretty feeble!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 17, 2013, 22:36
They told me that people who paint for a living would sweat paint from their skin. They said when this auto body painter was in the sauna the whole sauna smelled like car paint and green paint would seep from his pores covering the towel in green paint. LOL.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: 10oriocookies on December 17, 2013, 23:01
I have actually Never heard of JJ doing anything like this.  The guy should have made a police report.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 17, 2013, 23:11
They told me that people who paint for a living would sweat paint from their skin. They said when this auto body painter was in the sauna the whole sauna smelled like car paint and green paint would seep from his pores covering the towel in green paint. LOL.

LOL!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 18, 2013, 00:15
Esacpee-

I just read Michael G's story. That sounds so much like my story. Everything he experienced I experienced except for the physical abuse.

They won't let you pass parts of the program until you comply / write good things on paper. I never did any of that. Theres a part of the program where you have to write down every bad thing you've ever done in your whole life. They make me spend at least 24 focused hours writing this stuff down on a piece of paper that they keep. I wouldn't do this. I wasn't going to let them have something they could use to blackmail me with later.

Another thing that sketched me out was every Friday we would meet in the big sun room and have a graduation/awards ceremony. For every part of the program you completed you were called up to a podium in front of everyone at the facility to give a speech and say what you got out of the program, thank people, etc. They always had a video camera and would record everyones testimonials. Every time I was called up there I just said thank god i'm done with this part, and would sit down. They really didn't like this. I didn't want them to have any documentation that I was getting anything out of this sham-of-a-program.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 18, 2013, 00:25
It was common for other "students" to get so frustrated they would flee the Narconon property with no money or any form of communication. No one knew their way around and the farthest place people would get was a gas station. Most of them ended up coming back but there were a lot who didnt.

I can remember 2 older guys quit and left the program after being there for awhile. An older woman left. A girl's mother came to pull her out of the program and was getting so much resistance that she called the police. The mother entered Narconon with a sheriff and pulled her daughter out of the program. My roomate was really religious kid, he had his girlfriend drive from Idaho one night to come pick him up. He sneaked out at out night and never saw him again. I'm still not sure how he arranged that as his girlfriend didn't know the area, nor did he, and he didnt have any means of communication. In the morning they found out he left and they tried to punish me! I logically countered every argument they proposed as to why I should be punished and ended up not avoiding punishment.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: ethercat on December 18, 2013, 09:22
Those videotaped "success" stories seem really unethical to me.  First, people having to do them in the first place to complete the different parts of the program; and secondly, the implications of people possibly being put up on YouTube who aren't aware of (or concerned with) the fact that they might be seen by potential employers and other people they might not want to know they'd had an addiction problem.  This just does not strike me as something a legit rehab would do.  HIPAA violation?  And thirdly, the possible use of them in a lawsuit or as blackmail that you mentioned.

Of course, that's in addition to all the other unethical behaviors on the part of Narconon.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: source on December 18, 2013, 09:25
To pull someone out of NARCONON is considered a great evil.  When it happens they refer to their tech and feel like it must be that the mom, girlfriend, roommate, etc is a suppressive person and probably why the addict uses drugs in the first place.

It gets kind of creepy when you are a student and you have a family member that starts to get antagonistic towards NARCONON.  They start to refer you to Book 5 and try and get you to "realize" that your parents are the cause of your addictions.  I think this policy is really scary.  In other words, right away they lay a foundation that if mom is against scientology it's probably a sign that she caused your addiction. 

Even if they pull someone out of NARCONON and put their kid in a premier drug rehab, it is considered a suppressive act because they are pulled out of NARCONON.  Choosing any rehab other than NARCONON is considered a suppressive act. 

Although people probably wouldn't care, but asking for a refund also puts you on the blacklist of suppressive peoples.  It's the same policy at an Org.

Creepy stuff.

Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 18, 2013, 11:49
Source- good point. I believe thats why I was kicked out. Once I started to question the program they were telling my parents awful things, trying to turn my parents against me. Sadly to say, they achieved this. My parents thought I was just making stuff up trying to get out of treatment. I had the money to get back home and was planning to leave but Narconon convinced my parents to disown me if I did so. Once my parents did some investigation they were disgusted. My father wanted to fly out to Narconon to take a look around, and they didn't like this. I was kicked out literally the day my dad demanded to come visit. Go figure.

I just can't wrap my head around how stupid people can be, no offense to anyone but this is how I really feel. I say that, but honestly I can see how people fall for turning into a NarCONon lifer. By lifer, I mean the people who end up working there and supporting its cause. Many times I would try to reason with these people on the things they said. Its almost impossible. They are so brainwashed and they have different definitions for words. They change the meaning of words to support their cause.

Anytime mentioned I wanted to leave NarCONon and receive treatment somewhere else I was constantly threatened with "you already signed a legal contract, if you leave, you will not be refunded $30,000." I think that is the reason most people don't up and leave.

After they kicked me out of NarCONon I was driven a few hours away to a train station to get dropped off at. On the way I had a chat with the the guy driving me. He worked in the ethics department. I'm surprised he said a lot of the things he said. He said that his whole family doesn't like NarCONon and they want him to find a job somewhere else and how they are at odds. I thought it was really sad that this guy is so brainwashed into fighting for the NarCONon cause that he is at odds with his whole family.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: BigBeard on December 18, 2013, 11:58
Most legitimate rehabs encourage family support and visits, unlike narCONon. Turning families against each other this way should be a red flag to anyone looking at NN.

Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 18, 2013, 17:45
Quote

I just can't wrap my head around how stupid people can be, no offense to anyone but this is how I really feel. I say that, but honestly I can see how people fall for turning into a NarCONon lifer. By lifer, I mean the people who end up working there and supporting its cause. Many times I would try to reason with these people on the things they said. Its almost impossible. They are so brainwashed and they have different definitions for words. They change the meaning of words to support their cause.


You're bright, and correct that Scientology uses LWrongHubbard's made-up lingo to keep the sheeple in line.

When Mary Rieser, ED for Narconon of Georgia was interviewed by WSB-TV, she was obviously lying, but between that interview and her depositions in the Desmond case, I had the impression that she believed her lies. That certainly seems like brainwashing to me.

http://forum.reachingforthetippingpoint.net/index.php/topic,8408.msg19367.html#msg19367
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Cigul on December 18, 2013, 18:31
It has very little to do with intelligence and everything to do with suggestibility. What $cientology and narconon does is straight up and down brainwashing. Google "brainwashing techniques" and prepare to be less-than-surprised when you spot all of the ones that $cientology, and by extension narconon, uses. I will give L. Ron credit for one thing, he knew how to con people. From the bad food to the cheap hypnotism. And all extravagantly priced.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 18, 2013, 22:38
^^^^ Yup! In a nutsell.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Escapee on December 19, 2013, 09:12
Esacpee-

I just read Michael G's story. That sounds so much like my story. Everything he experienced I experienced except for the physical abuse.

They won't let you pass parts of the program until you comply / write good things on paper. I never did any of that. Theres a part of the program where you have to write down every bad thing you've ever done in your whole life. They make me spend at least 24 focused hours writing this stuff down on a piece of paper that they keep. I wouldn't do this. I wasn't going to let them have something they could use to blackmail me with later.

Another thing that sketched me out was every Friday we would meet in the big sun room and have a graduation/awards ceremony. For every part of the program you completed you were called up to a podium in front of everyone at the facility to give a speech and say what you got out of the program, thank people, etc. They always had a video camera and would record everyones testimonials. Every time I was called up there I just said thank god i'm done with this part, and would sit down. They really didn't like this. I didn't want them to have any documentation that I was getting anything out of this sham-of-a-program.

It's my story too,pretty much! Besides the physical part of it..I really hated the fact that EVERYTHING you did was recorded by staff good staff or bad staff! Because they were afraid they would have to work conditions! I had a big problem with o/w's "all the bad stuff you did in life" cause they changed the process while I was there! They kept them till the end.  But if you look in the back of the book it says the c/s will read threw them and give them back to the student who wrote them! I brought this page of the book to the higher ups! Also had to fill out a Csw to have this meeting! All they did was tr us in circles. Saying we will call NARCONON int and have the books reprinted lol I thought nothing was true until it's written! They always want data on something until it reverses their overall objectives!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 20, 2013, 04:40
After I was home for awhile a person I was there with contacted me to discuss Narconon. His parents yanked him out of Narconon and put him into a really a good program (thank god). He sent me a document his mother wrote about the experience. Would it be okay for me to post it here? If there is any identifiable information I will remove it. I was told I could post it here by someone that owns a different anti-Narconon site, but I figured I would get permission first.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: 10oriocookies on December 20, 2013, 07:33
Totally fine.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: ethercat on December 20, 2013, 09:10
After I was home for awhile a person I was there with contacted me to discuss Narconon. His parents yanked him out of Narconon and put him into a really a good program (thank god). He sent me a document his mother wrote about the experience. Would it be okay for me to post it here? If there is any identifiable information I will remove it. I was told I could post it here by someone that owns a different anti-Narconon site, but I figured I would get permission first.

Yes, thank you, please do.  Every story has a chance to touch someone who otherwise might have decided to go or send someone they love to Narconon.

You might also ask him to do the Narconon Survey, if he hasn't already.  And yourself as well, if you haven't. 
The link to the survey is: http://reachingforthetippingpoint.net/narcononsurvey/ 
It can be public or private.  Be sure to choose public if you want to spread the word.   :)

And a big  :-thanks-: to you for being so forthcoming here with your own experience.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 20, 2013, 09:13
Also, what is the other anti-Narconon site you mentioned? Thanks.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: ethercat on December 20, 2013, 13:45
Also, what is the other anti-Narconon site you mentioned? Thanks.

Yup!  We must thank them for referring people to us. 

And pay them their 10% referral fee.  Just as soon as Big Pharma and the Psyches pay us.   :-D^\^\
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 20, 2013, 17:03

Yup!  We must thank them for referring people to us. 

And pay them their 10% referral fee.  Just as soon as Big Pharma and the Psyches pay us.   :-D^\^\

;-) 
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 20, 2013, 21:43
Quote
Also, what is the other anti-Narconon site you mentioned? Thanks.

NarcononExposed
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: mefree on December 21, 2013, 00:17
Quote
Also, what is the other anti-Narconon site you mentioned? Thanks.

NarcononExposed

Thanks. That's a great site!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Mary_McConnell on December 26, 2013, 23:30
After I was home for awhile a person I was there with contacted me to discuss Narconon. His parents yanked him out of Narconon and put him into a really a good program (thank god). He sent me a document his mother wrote about the experience. Would it be okay for me to post it here? If there is any identifiable information I will remove it. I was told I could post it here by someone that owns a different anti-Narconon site, but I figured I would get permission first.

We love success stories like that.

Did you mean the Facebook group Narconon Exposed? https://www.facebook.com/BuyerBeware

Or the website? http://www.narconon-exposed.org

We know all the people involved in exposing Narconon and often collaborate on matters with them so it's no problem to post it :)
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on December 29, 2013, 08:06
I meant the website.

Sorry I kinda forgot about it and I have to search through a few thumb drives. I will find it and post it!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: ethercat on December 29, 2013, 10:16
Sorry I kinda forgot about it and I have to search through a few thumb drives. I will find it and post it!

No problem, NH.   :)  Looking forward to reading it!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on January 06, 2014, 11:24
First off, sorry for the delayed reply!
I overestimated the amount of flash drives that I own and for some reason this file was on an old 512mb one lol. I'm going to read through it and change the names of the people and then copy and paste it. I will be back shortly!
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on January 06, 2014, 11:45
Here is the story of another Narconon victim.
I was at Narconon with this person. After leaving Narconon he contacted me and sent me this. Its a story his mother wrote.
As far as I know this isn't published anywhere else on the internet.
All I changed was his name, and edited out a medical condition.
If you see something that could identifying please let me know and I will remove it.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on January 06, 2014, 11:46
Narconon, Masters of Deception



My son, Chris, was addicted to Oxycodone, Suboxone and various other prescription pills. 

Things had been spiraling out of control for some time and I knew as his mother that he didn’t have much time and I had to find a way to save him.

I looked on the Internet at the many facilities and called each one.  The prices of 25,000 – 30,000 a month were prohibitive.

Finally I came across Narconon Vista Bay in California and spoke to “Mike DePalma”, one of their sales staff.  He provided credibility to the program by telling me his story of how he was an addict himself who had graduated from the program.

When I asked if this was a religious organization, he said emphatically “absolutely not!” 

I then asked the price and he said it was a one time non-refundable fee of $33,000.  He explained that Chris could stay up to seven months and might even be eligible to retain work there. He explained that everyone on the premise was an ex-addict and a graduate of the program.

When I told him that my son was XXXXX (removed medical condition) and addicted to Oxycodone and that he would require a doctor’s care to come off these drugs, he assured me that they were very well equipped with the best doctors and care available.  He said that they were a “non-profit” facility and 76% of their patients were healed through their program.  He stated that theirs was a more “holistic approach” with a Sauna program, vitamins, healthy food and exercise. 

I then explained that this was an urgent situation and that I needed to have an intervention done this very week.  I told him what I was planning and he convinced me that having a professional fly out there would be his best advice.  When I showed concern for the price, he told me that I might qualify for their discount program.

He called me back within an hour and told me he could have a professional fly out the next day and offered me a discount of $2,000 making the price $31,000 if I could pay the air fare and hotel room.

I picked “Ben DeLong” up at the airport and brought him to his hotel room.  I was impressed that he hadn’t chosen a fancy hotel but one that was very reasonable.  When I asked him about himself, he explained that he was an ex-addict who had graduated from the program and had been clean for 7 years.  He had worked with Narconon for 5 years and was now married and working as an interventionist.

We had family and friends gather at his hotel room that night for a four hour “pre-intervention coaching” session.  We were told to write a letter with one paragraph telling what Chris was like now and two paragraphs of how he used to be with the last few lines asking him to accept this help.  We were further coached to follow him whenever he got up, never to leave him alone and to read our letters in the order that he decided would be most influential. 

The next morning we arrived in three cars, blocking Chris’s car in the driveway.  He was just getting up.  Circling him, Ben started by telling his story and then on cue, we each read our letters.  Every time Chris got up, we all followed. 

By noon, Chris accepted our pleas, packed and flew with Ben to CA that afternoon.

After they left, my daughter felt concerned. She had noticed that Ben had a very long pinkie nail, usually used to snort Cocaine.  “Why would he have a nail like that if he were really an “ex-addict?”” she questioned.

After Chris’s arrival, the financial office called for payment and my ex-husband and I put up our credit cards not knowing how we were ever really going to pay for this.  We didn’t care; we just had to do whatever it was going to take to save our beautiful boy.

It was understood that it would be about 10 days before I could have any contact with Chris as he would have to go through detoxification. They were great at calling me everyday with an update on how he was progressing.

After two weeks, Chris was able to talk to me and told me that the people were “really nice” and the place was clean and the food was good.  I was just so relieved and told everyone the good news.

About two months later, Chris told me that there was some “really strange stuff” going on.  He said “they make us do these drills where we just sit and stare at each other for seven hours at a time”.  He then asked me if I thought it strange that all the “higher ups from Narconon” were going to this one church located on the property and that they were all driving Mercedes!  He said,  “Isn’t this place supposed to be a non-profit?”

When I asked what kind of church, he said he was not allowed to say, but then covered his mouth on the phone and whispered “Scientology”.  He also wanted to know if anyone contacted me to ask what we were talking about.  He told me that one kid got thrown out for talking about “Scientology”. 

Shocked, I asked if he, himself, had been forced to go to that church and he said “not yet”. “How do you know that this was in fact “Scientology”?”  I asked.  He said that all of his books were written by L. Ron Hubbard, founder of Scientology and told me to look it up on the Internet.

Completely shocked, I googled “Scientology” and found that L. Ron Hubbard was in fact the founder.  Next I googled “Narconon Vista Bay + Scientology” and went screaming out of the room!

I found that everything I had been told was a lie and that there were in fact no doctors; the detoxification was considered “dangerous” and the Sauna program found “useless”.  The drills my son had been participating in were in fact “brain-washing” tactics and the whole thing was a front for Scientology!

I took my beautiful boy from the fry pan and threw him into the FIRE!

I called family members and told them of my horror.  I needed to get him out of there, find a new place for him to go and more money to pay for it!

My mother told me of my cousin who had sent his son to a facility in Canada and he had been clean for 3.5 years!  I called Edgewood, located in Nanaimo, BC.  They had a room available the following week. 

My mother offered to pay for this facility and paid for our flights out there.  Within one week, a new plan was in place and all without my son’s knowledge.  We didn’t want to risk his security.

My daughter, her boyfriend and myself flew out to San Francisco and the next day rented a car to arrive unannounced before Chris’s scheduled class started at 10:00 am.  We pulled into the parking lot.  Narconon Vista Bay looked like a temple perched on top of several flights of stairs.

We walked in and found one young man behind the desk.  I plopped my purse on the desk, smiled and kindly asked to see my son.  His immediate response was” Oh, you’re coming to pick him up!”  I said, “I don’t know what you mean, I know that his class will be starting in about 5 minutes, and I would like to see him.”  The young man appeared agitated and was trying to locate someone by texting and punching numbers into the phone.

I looked at the clock and it was now 9:58am.  I said, “ I really need to see him before his class starts”.  Then I heard from the other side of the wall the words “Roll Call!”  I said “Oh he must be right beside us, can you get him?”  The young man said, “This is a very large campus and your son could be in any location.  I will have to get a hold of someone to find out where he is.” 

Just then I heard the person in charge of the “roll call” say “Chris here?”  “Here!” I heard.  Furious, I walked behind the young man and pulled the curtain to find my son standing right in front of me on the other side of the glass wall!

Chris looked up and stood back in complete shock as he thought he had seen a ghost!  I motioned for him to come around to see us.  Then I turned my attention to the young man behind the desk and lost it!

I yelled at him that he was a liar and that everything I had been told was nothing but a lie!!  Just then several councilors’ started coming in.  One very blond, very tall, and very skinny lady introduced herself as one of Chris’s counselors and asked us to step into the conference room.  I declined saying “I came here to see my son, I didn’t come here to talk to you.”  I walked over to look at the books being displayed all around the room.  They were all by the author L. Ron Hubbard.

 Taking a seat now close to the door, another councilor sat down beside me.  He said, ”We’ve been here a long time and we know the drill.  We know you saw the Internet and have come to pick up your son”.  I said, “Now that our gloves are off, where is he? It doesn’t take 10 minutes to walk around the corner!”

The skinny blond girl came over and said, “ I know what you read on the Internet and you think we are Scientology, but we are not.”  Just then Chris walked into the room.  He looked great!  He had gained 35 pounds and wore a big huge smile.  As we stood by the door hugging him, the blond lady came over again to ask that we come into the conference room.  I spoke up and said we would like to talk with Chris outside.

Chris and I went outside and sat on a nearby bench.  My daughter and her boyfriend stood in front of us so we could talk with some privacy. The councilors were walking past us constantly, supposedly trying to hear what was being said.

Chris seemed shocked and hesitant when we told him what we had read about Narconon Vista Bay on the Internet.  After some discussion, Chris agreed to come with us.  We walked back in and Chris told them he would be leaving with us.  The blond girl was upset and told us we were making a big mistake.  I replied, “The only mistake I made, was trusting you!”

We flew to Vancouver Island and drove to Nanaimo, BC Canada.  Although Chris looked better, I could tell he was still a very lost soul.  He was bitter when we dropped him off at Edgewood and all I could do was pray that I had done the right thing, this time.

April 8th 2012 marks one year that Chris has been clean of any substance. Edgewood and their professional staff of doctors, psychologists and graduates have given him the tools to live a better life and most importantly how to live on a budget! This is a facility that should be replicated!

Narconon has many facilities all over the world and are masters of deception!  Their name is similar to “Nar-Anon” which stands for “Narcotics Anonymous” along with an affordable price, by comparison, positioning them to take advantage of thousands of compromised adults and desperate families.

Their Web Gurus bought and own hundreds of keywords representing every type of drug inquiry ensuring their name pops up first to net their victims.  As long as the word “Scientology” is not connected, the web will show Narconon as an “excellent rehab facility”.  I called the “Tip Hotline” for help and realized that they, too, were involved with steering families towards Narconon.

Narconon uses every tactic of manipulation!  They prove credibility through their website and by their sales staff telling their own success stories.  They are competitively priced, and insinuate via their website that they are not religious by following a more holistic approach - not the the “12 step” program.  They understand the sense of urgency with desperate parents.  They are accommodating and influential touting pain-free detox in their sauna program. Worst of all, they provide hope to their victims making up glorified stories of “ex-addicts” and the possibility of a job in the future.  Everything is lies all lies.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: source on January 06, 2014, 13:50
Quote
I then explained that this was an urgent situation and that I needed to have an intervention done this very week.  I told him what I was planning and he convinced me that having a professional fly out there would be his best advice.  When I showed concern for the price, he told me that I might qualify for their discount program.

He called me back within an hour and told me he could have a professional fly out the next day and offered me a discount of $2,000 making the price $31,000 if I could pay the air fare and hotel room.

This appears to be something new.  Usually interventionists are outside and independent of treatment facilities and get paid from the family.  In this story, it appears that this is an interventionist who is working directly for Narconon Vista Bay and is a "free interventionist (except for flight and hotel)".  Which means that Narconon Vista Bay is now paying interventionists directly or having them work directly for the center.

Wonder what happens if the client doesn't go to treatment?  Does Ben Delong still get paid?

Beyond that, this story appears to be identical to the hundreds of similar stories from families.

But, it is interesting that Narconon Vista Bay seems to have a Church of Scientology on or near the premises.  I thought Arrowhead was the only one that had something similar to a Church of Scientology in the building.

Although not to make light of this situation, I couldn't help but think of the scene in the end of the wizard of oz.


Quote
The young man said, “This is a very large campus and your son could be in any location.  I will have to get a hold of someone to find out where he is.” 

Quote
Just then I heard the person in charge of the “roll call” say “Chris here?”  “Here!” I heard.  Furious, I walked behind the young man and pulled the curtain to find my son standing right in front of me on the other side of the glass wall!

So like Narconon.  Please don't look there...pay attention over here.

"Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!!!!"
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on January 06, 2014, 18:05
Source-

When I got to Narconon I found out that a lot of the other people there had these interventionists come talk them into going to rehab. In my case, I wanted to go get help so as far as I know this was never discussed. I didn't have an interventionist. I just spoke to two people over the phone one of them being "Mike DePalma" the same guy mentioned in the story above.

The interventionists are affiliated with Scientology, anyone can become one. A girl in the withdraw cabin with me had one of these interventionists bring her to Narconon. She was really happy and excited because her interventionists offered her the job of becoming an interventionist if she completed the program... At this point I didn't know Narconon was a bad place but that was another thing that tipped me off.

If you finish the program at Narconon Vista Bay you can recruit people to come to Narconon and make $3,000 per person. I remember a lot of people were talking about taking up this offer. I thought that was really fucked up.

I bet Ben Delong still gets paid if the person doesn't go to treatment, but maybe not.

As far as I know Narconon Vista Bay doesn't have a church on the premises. When I got out of the withdraw cabin they asked me if I wanted to attend church and I said yes. I was never able to go though, they wouldn't let me. They let girls go but they didn't let me. I thought they were going to take me to a church affiliated with my religion but I guess not. I never found out what church the girls were going to.

Lol @ Wizard of Oz reference!

Edit: I can't remember one person who wasn't brought to Narconon without an interventionist. I seemed to be the only one.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: Mary_McConnell on January 17, 2014, 19:12
I really appreciate all the posts on this thread. Special thanks to NarcononHater.
Title: Re: I went to Narconon Vista Bay and was kicked out AMA
Post by: NarcononHater on January 18, 2014, 14:04
No problem! If anyone reading this has any questions, I'm more than happy to answer them.